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6 Feb Re: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 96, Issue 5 [George Sims ] 6 Feb Re: Distribution of American odonates [Steve Collins ] 3 Feb Distribution of American odonates [Alex Córdoba ] 3 Feb Re: PhD thesis abstract romanian dreagonflies [Marc Tailly ] 3 Feb Re: [WestPalOdos] PhD thesis abstract romanian dreagonflies [|Mill ] 3 Feb PhD thesis abstract romanian dreagonflies ["Cosmin O. Manci" ] 2 Feb Fwd: [se-odonata] ASSISTANCE REQUIRED FOR THE IDENTIFICATION OF ODONATA NAIADS [Joshua Rose ] 31 Jan Re: Head vibrations in Aesha species (Erland Nielsen) [Martha Smith ] 30 Jan Head vibrations in Aesha species [Erland Nielsen ] 28 Jan Chrysobasis lucifer article in Ft Myers Newspaper [IORI ] 28 Jan Chrysobasis lucifer article in Ft Myers Newspaper ["IORI" ] 28 Jan Chrysobasis lucifer article in Ft Myers Newspaper ["IORI" ] 28 Jan Chrysobasis lucifer article in Ft Myers Newspaper ["IORI" ] 28 Jan Re: Head and Eye movement of Libellula vibrans as it is about to take off RE: "Socially Interactive" behaviors of the Libellula vibrans, Libellula lydia, Erythemis simplicicollis and Pachydi[plax longipennis [Martha Smith ] 28 Jan "Socially Interactive" behaviors of the Libellula vibrans, Libellula lydia, Erythemis simplicicollis and Pachydi[plax longipennis [Martha Smith ] 27 Jan Fwd: Aquatic Entomology Seminar at Eagle Hill [Dennis Paulson ] 27 Jan Re: Membranule? [Colin Adams ] 27 Jan Membranule? [Guillon ] 25 Jan Re: thanks for the photos [Marc Tailly ] 24 Jan thanks for the photos ["Cosmin O. Manci" ] 24 Jan Re: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 95, Issue 18 [] 23 Jan Thailand odes [jeremy gatten ] 23 Jan Puerto Rico and odonates ["George L. Harp" ] 23 Jan new contact info [Jason Bried ] 21 Jan (no subject) ["Cosmin O. Manci" ] 20 Jan Re: Erythrodiplax plates [Rosser Garrison ] 20 Jan Erythrodiplax plates [rhainer guillermo ] 19 Jan help with photo ["Cosmin O. Manci" ] 15 Jan Looking for Odonata photos for a field guide [Erik Hirschfeld ] 11 Jan International Journal of Odonatology is Calling for Papers [Taylor Francis ] 10 Jan Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings [Dennis Paulson ] 10 Jan Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings [Sherry McCowan ] 10 Jan Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings [Sherry McCowan ] 10 Jan Grant opportunities - Montana [George Sims ] 10 Jan Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings ["Laudermilk, Ellis (EEC)" ] 9 Jan Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings ["Rowe, Richard" ] 9 Jan Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings [Marion Dobbs ] 9 Jan Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings [Dennis Paulson ] 9 Jan Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings [Mike Ferro ] 9 Jan Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings [Dennis Paulson ] 9 Jan Fwd: dragonfly closes wings [Dennis Paulson ] 9 Jan grant opportunities for survey/monitoring? [Andrea Stephens ] 9 Jan Fwd: dragonfly closes wings [Dennis Paulson ] 9 Jan Re: dragonfly closes wings [David Vilasis ] 9 Jan Re: dragonfly closes wings [Dennis Paulson ] 9 Jan Re: dragonfly closes wings [Keith Wilson ] 9 Jan Re: dragonfly closes wings [rhainer guillermo ] 9 Jan Re: dragonfly closes wings [David Kitching ] 9 Jan Re: dragonfly closes wings [Mike Ferro ] 9 Jan Re: dragonfly closes wings [Colin Adams ] 9 Jan Re: dragonfly closes wings [Tang Hung Bun ] 8 Jan Re: A Chilean damselfly quandary [rhainer guillermo ] 8 Jan Re: dragonfly closes wings [rhainer guillermo ] 8 Jan Re: dragonfly closes wings [Dennis Paulson ] 8 Jan Re: dragonfly closes wings [Dave McShaffrey ] 8 Jan Re: dragonfly closes wings [Jim Johnson ] 8 Jan Re: dragonfly closes wings [The Dragonfly Woman ] 8 Jan dragonfly closes wings [Dennis Paulson ] 8 Jan A Chilean damselfly quandary [Eric LoPresti ] 29 Dec Re: Odonata-L: Scans of E. Schmidt's (1915) plates [Matti Hamalainen ] 29 Dec Odonata-L: Scans of E. Schmidt's (1915) plates [Dirk Gassmann ] 23 Dec Jamaica and Dominican Republic [Adolfo Cordero Rivera ] 23 Dec a third Epiophleia discovered! [Adolfo Cordero Rivera ] 22 Dec For the birders Egretta thula with wild horses [Martha Smith ] 21 Dec Fwd: RFI: Asian Odonate researchers [Joshua Rose ] 10 Dec Re: DSA 2012 South Carolina Website up [Marion Dobbs ] 8 Dec Euphaea [Guillon ] 1 Dec Re: World Dragonfly Day(s)/Week(s) [Martha Smith ] 1 Dec RE: World Dragonfly Day(s)/Week(s) [Martha Smith ] 30 Nov Re: Dragonflies of North America [IORI ] 30 Nov Re: Dragonflies of North America [IORI ] 30 Nov Re: Dragonflies of North America [Joshua Rose ] 30 Nov Dragonflies of North America [George Sims ] 30 Nov Re: Schmidt paper [Dirk Gassmann ] 30 Nov Re: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 (APPinto) ["Frederico A.A. Lencioni" ] 30 Nov Re: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 (APPinto) [Ângelo P. Pinto ] Subject: Re: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 96, Issue 5 From: George Sims <georgesims AT hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 6 Feb 2012 17:11:59 -0600 > From: odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 96, Issue 5 > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Date: Mon, 6 Feb 2012 13:23:10 -0800 > > Send Odonata-l mailing list submissions to > odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu > > You can reach the person managing the list at > odonata-l-owner AT listhost.ups.edu > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Odonata-l digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Distribution of American odonates (Steve Collins) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 6 Feb 2012 15:23:11 -0600 > From: Steve Collins > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Distribution of American odonates > To: "'Odonata-l'" > Message-ID: <4F3044BF.4090606 AT ufl.edu> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Greetings, > > Some of you are already aware and have seen my presentations at the last > two annual DSA meetings, but I am also working on a similar project.For > my PhD research, I am developing river-reach-scale models of the > distribution of U.S. dragonflies and damselflies which are largely > restricted to flowing waters.I have contacted a number of you > individually requesting data.If you are willing to provide locality > data, please let me know.All data with a specific location are > useful.These types of predictive models may aid our understanding of the > ecology and potential distribution of these species and aid future > conservation efforts, but only if enough known locations are available. > > Below are the U.S. species that I am interested in modeling.Most of > these species are restricted to flowing water. > > If you have any questions or would like to learn more about my project, > don't hesitate to email me.Thank you for your help! > > Cheers, > > Steve Collins > > PhD Candidate > > Department of Biological Sciences > > Texas Tech University > > Flint and Main Street, MS 3131 > > Lubbock, TX 79409-3131 > > steve.collins AT ttu.edu > > Superb Jewelwing (Calopteryx amata) > > Appalachian Jewelwing (Calopteryx angustipennis) > > Sparkling Jewelwing (Calopteryx dimidiata) > > Ebony Jewelwing (Calopteryx maculata) > > American Rubyspot (Hetaerina americana) > > Smoky Rubyspot (Hetaerina titia) > > Canyon Rubyspot (Hetaerina vulnerata) > > Great Spreadwing (Archilestes grandis) > > Coral-fronted Threadtail (Neoneura aaroni) > > Orange-striped Threadtail (Protoneura cara) > > California Dancer (Argia agrioides) > > Comanche Dancer (Argia barretti) > > Coppery Dancer (Argia cuprea) > > Kiowa Dancer (Argia immunda) > > Leonora's Dancer (Argia leonorae) > > Sooty Dancer (Argia lugens) > > Aztec Dancer (Argia nahuana) > > Amethyst Dancer (Argia pallens) > > Springwater Dancer (Argia plana) > > Golden-winged Dancer (Argia rhoadsi) > > Blue-ringed Dancer (Argia sedula) > > Blue-tipped Dancer (Argia tibialis) > > Dusky Dancer (Argia translata) > > Vivid Dancer (Argia vivida) > > River Bluet (Enallagma anna) > > Purple Bluet (Enallagma cardenium) > > Neotropical Bluet (Enallagma novaehispaniae) > > Exclamation Damsel (Zoniagrion exclamationis) > > Walker's Darner (Aeshna walkeri) > > Persephone's Darner (Aeshna persephone) > > Giant Darner (Anax walsinghami) > > Fawn Darner (Boyeria vinosa) > > Riffle Darner (Oplonaeschna armata) > > White-belted Ringtail (Erpetogomphus compositus) > > Eastern Ringtail (Erpetogomphus designatus) > > Dashed Ringtail (Erpetogomphus heterodon) > > Serpent Ringtail (Erpetogomphus lampropeltis) > > Spine-crowned Clubtail (Gomphus abbreviatus) > > Banner Clubtail (Gomphus apomyius) > > Cherokee Clubtail (Gomphus consanguis) > > Handsome Clubtail (Gomphus crassus) > > Harpoon Clubtail (Gomphus descriptus) > > Blackwater Clubtail (Gomphus dilatatus) > > Twin-striped Clubtail (Gomphus geminatus) > > Hodges's Clubtail (Gomphus hodgesi) > > Cocoa Clubtail (Gomphus hybridus) > > Splendid Clubtail (Gomphus lineatifrons) > > Columbia Clubtail (Gomphus lynnae) > > Gulf Coast Clubtail (Gomphus modestus) > > Ozark Clubtail (Gomphus ozarkensis) > > Piedmont Clubtail (Gomphus parvidens) > > Rapids Clubtail (Gomphus quadricolor) > > Sable Clubtail (Gomphus rogersi) > > Tennessee Clubtail (Gomphus sandrius) > > Septima's Clubtail (Gomphus septima) > > Green-faced Clubtail (Gomphus viridifrons) > > Northern Pygmy Clubtail (Lanthus parvulus) > > Southern Pygmy Clubtail (Lanthus vernalis) > > Grappletail (Octogomphus specularis) > > Acuminate Snaketail (Ophiogomphus acuminatus) > > Extra-striped Snaketail (Ophiogomphus anomalus) > > Arizona Snaketail (Ophiogomphus arizonicus) > > Brook Snaketail (Ophiogomphus aspersus) > > Southern Snaketail (Ophiogomphus australis) > > Bison Snaketail (Ophiogomphus bison) > > Riffle Snaketail (Ophiogomphus carolus) > > Boreal Snaketail (Ophiogomphus colubrinus) > > Edmund's Snaketail (Ophiogomphus edmundo) > > Pygmy Snaketail (Ophiogomphus howei) > > Appalachian Snaketail (Ophiogomphus incurvatus) > > Maine Snaketail (Ophiogomphus mainensis) > > Great Basin Snaketail (Ophiogomphus morrisoni) > > Sinuous Snaketail (Ophiogomphus occidentis) > > Rusty Snaketail (Ophiogomphus rupinsulensis) > > Pale Snaketail (Ophiogomphus severus) > > Sioux Snaketail (Ophiogomphus smithi) > > St. Croix Snaketail (Ophiogomphus susbehcha) > > Westfall's Snaketail (Ophiogomphus westfalli) > > Five-striped Leaftail (Phyllogomphoides albrighti) > > Gray Sanddragon (Progomphus borealis) > > Eastern Least Clubtail (Stylogomphus albistylus) > > Interior Least Clubtail (Stylogomphus sigmastylus) > > Riverine Clubtail (Stylurus amnicola) > > Brimstone Clubtail (Stylurus intricatus) > > Shining Clubtail (Stylurus ivae) > > Laura's Clubtail (Stylurus laurae) > > Olive Clubtail (Stylurus olivaceus) > > Russet-tipped Clubtail (Stylurus plagiatus) > > Yellow-sided Clubtail (Stylurus potulentus) > > Zebra Clubtail (Stylurus scudderi) > > Arrow Clubtail (Stylurus spiniceps) > > Townes's Clubtail (Stylurus townesi) > > Allegheny River Cruiser (Macromia alleghaniensis) > > Bronzed River Cruiser (Macromia annulata) > > Swift River Cruiser (Macromia illinoiensis) > > Western River Cruiser (Macromia magnifica) > > Mountain River Cruiser (Macromia margarita) > > Gilded River Cruiser (Macromia pacifica) > > Royal River Cruiser (Macromia taeniolata) > > Brown Spiketail (Cordulegaster bilineata) > > Delta-spotted Spiketail (Cordulegaster diastatops) > > Selys's Sundragon (Helocordulia selysii) > > Alabama Shadowdragon (Neurocordulia alabamensis) > > Broad-tailed Shadowdragon (Neurocordulia michaeli) > > Smoky Shadowdragon (Neurocordulia molesta) > > Umber Shadowdragon (Neurocordulia obsoleta) > > Cinnamon Shadowdragon (Neurocordulia virginiensis) > > Stygian Shadowdragon (Neurocordulia yamaskanensis) > > Coppery Emerald (Somatochlora georgiana) > > Plains Emerald (Somatochlora ensigera) > > Mocha Emerald (Somatochlora linearis) > > Ozark Emerald (Somatochlora ozarkensis) > > Pale-faced Clubskimmer (Brechmorhoga mendax) > > Comanche Skimmer (Libellula comanche) > > Neon Skimmer (Libellula croceipennis) > > Ivory-striped Sylph (Macrothemis imitans) > > Jade-striped Sylph (Macrothemis inequiunguis) > > Red Rock Skimmer (Paltothemis lineatipes) > > Filigree Skimmer (Pseudoleon superbus) > > > On 2/3/2012 10:39 AM, Alex C?rdoba wrote: > > Dear colleagues and friends, > > > > I recently received a major grant to model actual and potential distribution of > > odonate species occurring in Mexico. However, I want to extend this to the whole > > continent. We have a pretty respectable data base for Mexico and USA (using sources > > such as Odonata Central, GBIF, CONABIO and a number of faunistic books and papers) but > > for the rest of the continent (Canada, Central and South America), we have very little > > information. I would greatly appreciate your cooperation/guidance on localities. This > > information can come from web sites, published material and, very importantly, > > unpublished personal records. If you would like to provide me with such details, I > > would be immensely happy. > > > > HOWEVER, let me tell you this can become a truly collaborative project for those > > parties that want to work hand by hand with my team. I can actually secure money for a > > couple of meetings here in Mexico to review action plans and potential results. In > > case you are interested, please let me know. > > > > Thanks a lot. > > > > Alex > > -- > > Now available: The Evolution of Primary Sexual Characters in Animals. > > 2010. Edited by Janet Leonard and Alex Cordoba-Aguilar. Oxford University Press. > > > > http://www.oup.com/us/catalog/general/subject/LifeSciences/EvolutionaryBiology/? > > view=usa&sf=toc&ci=9780195325553 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Odonata-l mailing list > > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20120206/b7b1548f/attachment.html > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > > End of Odonata-l Digest, Vol 96, Issue 5 > **************************************** _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Distribution of American odonates From: Steve Collins <dcollins AT ufl.edu> Date: Mon, 6 Feb 2012 15:23:11 -0600 Greetings, Some of you are already aware and have seen my presentations at the last two annual DSA meetings, but I am also working on a similar project.For my PhD research, I am developing river-reach-scale models of the distribution of U.S. dragonflies and damselflies which are largely restricted to flowing waters.I have contacted a number of you individually requesting data.If you are willing to provide locality data, please let me know.All data with a specific location are useful.These types of predictive models may aid our understanding of the ecology and potential distribution of these species and aid future conservation efforts, but only if enough known locations are available. Below are the U.S. species that I am interested in modeling.Most of these species are restricted to flowing water. If you have any questions or would like to learn more about my project, don't hesitate to email me.Thank you for your help! Cheers, Steve Collins PhD Candidate Department of Biological Sciences Texas Tech University Flint and Main Street, MS 3131 Lubbock, TX 79409-3131 steve.collins AT ttu.edu Superb Jewelwing (Calopteryx amata) Appalachian Jewelwing (Calopteryx angustipennis) Sparkling Jewelwing (Calopteryx dimidiata) Ebony Jewelwing (Calopteryx maculata) American Rubyspot (Hetaerina americana) Smoky Rubyspot (Hetaerina titia) Canyon Rubyspot (Hetaerina vulnerata) Great Spreadwing (Archilestes grandis) Coral-fronted Threadtail (Neoneura aaroni) Orange-striped Threadtail (Protoneura cara) California Dancer (Argia agrioides) Comanche Dancer (Argia barretti) Coppery Dancer (Argia cuprea) Kiowa Dancer (Argia immunda) Leonora's Dancer (Argia leonorae) Sooty Dancer (Argia lugens) Aztec Dancer (Argia nahuana) Amethyst Dancer (Argia pallens) Springwater Dancer (Argia plana) Golden-winged Dancer (Argia rhoadsi) Blue-ringed Dancer (Argia sedula) Blue-tipped Dancer (Argia tibialis) Dusky Dancer (Argia translata) Vivid Dancer (Argia vivida) River Bluet (Enallagma anna) Purple Bluet (Enallagma cardenium) Neotropical Bluet (Enallagma novaehispaniae) Exclamation Damsel (Zoniagrion exclamationis) Walker's Darner (Aeshna walkeri) Persephone's Darner (Aeshna persephone) Giant Darner (Anax walsinghami) Fawn Darner (Boyeria vinosa) Riffle Darner (Oplonaeschna armata) White-belted Ringtail (Erpetogomphus compositus) Eastern Ringtail (Erpetogomphus designatus) Dashed Ringtail (Erpetogomphus heterodon) Serpent Ringtail (Erpetogomphus lampropeltis) Spine-crowned Clubtail (Gomphus abbreviatus) Banner Clubtail (Gomphus apomyius) Cherokee Clubtail (Gomphus consanguis) Handsome Clubtail (Gomphus crassus) Harpoon Clubtail (Gomphus descriptus) Blackwater Clubtail (Gomphus dilatatus) Twin-striped Clubtail (Gomphus geminatus) Hodges's Clubtail (Gomphus hodgesi) Cocoa Clubtail (Gomphus hybridus) Splendid Clubtail (Gomphus lineatifrons) Columbia Clubtail (Gomphus lynnae) Gulf Coast Clubtail (Gomphus modestus) Ozark Clubtail (Gomphus ozarkensis) Piedmont Clubtail (Gomphus parvidens) Rapids Clubtail (Gomphus quadricolor) Sable Clubtail (Gomphus rogersi) Tennessee Clubtail (Gomphus sandrius) Septima's Clubtail (Gomphus septima) Green-faced Clubtail (Gomphus viridifrons) Northern Pygmy Clubtail (Lanthus parvulus) Southern Pygmy Clubtail (Lanthus vernalis) Grappletail (Octogomphus specularis) Acuminate Snaketail (Ophiogomphus acuminatus) Extra-striped Snaketail (Ophiogomphus anomalus) Arizona Snaketail (Ophiogomphus arizonicus) Brook Snaketail (Ophiogomphus aspersus) Southern Snaketail (Ophiogomphus australis) Bison Snaketail (Ophiogomphus bison) Riffle Snaketail (Ophiogomphus carolus) Boreal Snaketail (Ophiogomphus colubrinus) Edmund's Snaketail (Ophiogomphus edmundo) Pygmy Snaketail (Ophiogomphus howei) Appalachian Snaketail (Ophiogomphus incurvatus) Maine Snaketail (Ophiogomphus mainensis) Great Basin Snaketail (Ophiogomphus morrisoni) Sinuous Snaketail (Ophiogomphus occidentis) Rusty Snaketail (Ophiogomphus rupinsulensis) Pale Snaketail (Ophiogomphus severus) Sioux Snaketail (Ophiogomphus smithi) St. Croix Snaketail (Ophiogomphus susbehcha) Westfall's Snaketail (Ophiogomphus westfalli) Five-striped Leaftail (Phyllogomphoides albrighti) Gray Sanddragon (Progomphus borealis) Eastern Least Clubtail (Stylogomphus albistylus) Interior Least Clubtail (Stylogomphus sigmastylus) Riverine Clubtail (Stylurus amnicola) Brimstone Clubtail (Stylurus intricatus) Shining Clubtail (Stylurus ivae) Laura's Clubtail (Stylurus laurae) Olive Clubtail (Stylurus olivaceus) Russet-tipped Clubtail (Stylurus plagiatus) Yellow-sided Clubtail (Stylurus potulentus) Zebra Clubtail (Stylurus scudderi) Arrow Clubtail (Stylurus spiniceps) Townes's Clubtail (Stylurus townesi) Allegheny River Cruiser (Macromia alleghaniensis) Bronzed River Cruiser (Macromia annulata) Swift River Cruiser (Macromia illinoiensis) Western River Cruiser (Macromia magnifica) Mountain River Cruiser (Macromia margarita) Gilded River Cruiser (Macromia pacifica) Royal River Cruiser (Macromia taeniolata) Brown Spiketail (Cordulegaster bilineata) Delta-spotted Spiketail (Cordulegaster diastatops) Selys's Sundragon (Helocordulia selysii) Alabama Shadowdragon (Neurocordulia alabamensis) Broad-tailed Shadowdragon (Neurocordulia michaeli) Smoky Shadowdragon (Neurocordulia molesta) Umber Shadowdragon (Neurocordulia obsoleta) Cinnamon Shadowdragon (Neurocordulia virginiensis) Stygian Shadowdragon (Neurocordulia yamaskanensis) Coppery Emerald (Somatochlora georgiana) Plains Emerald (Somatochlora ensigera) Mocha Emerald (Somatochlora linearis) Ozark Emerald (Somatochlora ozarkensis) Pale-faced Clubskimmer (Brechmorhoga mendax) Comanche Skimmer (Libellula comanche) Neon Skimmer (Libellula croceipennis) Ivory-striped Sylph (Macrothemis imitans) Jade-striped Sylph (Macrothemis inequiunguis) Red Rock Skimmer (Paltothemis lineatipes) Filigree Skimmer (Pseudoleon superbus) On 2/3/2012 10:39 AM, Alex Córdoba wrote: > Dear colleagues and friends, > > I recently received a major grant to model actual and potential distribution of > odonate species occurring in Mexico. However, I want to extend this to the whole > continent. We have a pretty respectable data base for Mexico and USA (using sources > such as Odonata Central, GBIF, CONABIO and a number of faunistic books and papers) but > for the rest of the continent (Canada, Central and South America), we have very little > information. I would greatly appreciate your cooperation/guidance on localities. This > information can come from web sites, published material and, very importantly, > unpublished personal records. If you would like to provide me with such details, I > would be immensely happy. > > HOWEVER, let me tell you this can become a truly collaborative project for those > parties that want to work hand by hand with my team. I can actually secure money for a > couple of meetings here in Mexico to review action plans and potential results. In > case you are interested, please let me know. > > Thanks a lot. > > Alex > -- > Now available: The Evolution of Primary Sexual Characters in Animals. > 2010. Edited by Janet Leonard and Alex Cordoba-Aguilar. Oxford University Press. > > http://www.oup.com/us/catalog/general/subject/LifeSciences/EvolutionaryBiology/? > view=usa&sf=toc&ci=9780195325553 > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > > > _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Distribution of American odonates From: Alex Córdoba <acordoba AT ecologia.unam.mx> Date: Fri, 3 Feb 2012 10:39:34 -0600 Dear colleagues and friends, I recently received a major grant to model actual and potential distribution of odonate species occurring in Mexico. However, I want to extend this to the whole continent. We have a pretty respectable data base for Mexico and USA (using sources such as Odonata Central, GBIF, CONABIO and a number of faunistic books and papers) but for the rest of the continent (Canada, Central and South America), we have very little information. I would greatly appreciate your cooperation/guidance on localities. This information can come from web sites, published material and, very importantly, unpublished personal records. If you would like to provide me with such details, I would be immensely happy. HOWEVER, let me tell you this can become a truly collaborative project for those parties that want to work hand by hand with my team. I can actually secure money for a couple of meetings here in Mexico to review action plans and potential results. In case you are interested, please let me know. Thanks a lot. Alex -- Now available: The Evolution of Primary Sexual Characters in Animals. 2010. Edited by Janet Leonard and Alex Cordoba-Aguilar. Oxford University Press. http://www.oup.com/us/catalog/general/subject/LifeSciences/EvolutionaryBiology/? view=usa&sf=toc&ci=9780195325553 _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: PhD thesis abstract romanian dreagonflies From: Marc Tailly <marc.tailly AT pandora.be> Date: Fri, 3 Feb 2012 17:33:31 +0100 Cosmin, I would be pleased to receive an abstract in english. Marc Tailly marc.tailly AT pandora.be ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cosmin O. Manci" To: Cc: Sent: Friday, February 03, 2012 1:30 PM Subject: [Odonata-l] PhD thesis abstract romanian dreagonflies Dear all, Now I have just finished my PhD thesis on Romanian dragonflies and working on the abstract (will be also one in english). I have to complete a list of at least 20 persons/specialists in the field that received the abstract. If someone is interested to receive the abstract (as pdf) can you please name yourself... so I can do also that list :) . I know that some of you want this but will be easier for me if you let me know it again. Today or tomorrow will end it so will be available for sending. Thank you and all my best, Cosmin _______________________________________________________ Cosmin-Ovidiu Manci biologist & photographer ********************** http://cosmln.nature4stock.com - cosmln's place http://dragonfly.nature4stock.com - Dragonflies of Romania http://birds.nature4stock.com - Birds of Romania http://mybiosis.info/nature/portal.php?pagename=firstpage - a romanian flora & fauna database and not only ********************** DSLR Collecting Saves Lives! ********************** " Only after the last tree has been cut down, only after the last river has been poisoned, only after the last fish has been caught, only then will you find that money can not be eaten. " an old indian saying _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: [WestPalOdos] PhD thesis abstract romanian dreagonflies From: |Mill <gpmill AT supanet.com> Date: Fri, 3 Feb 2012 14:17:53 +0000 Yes, I should like to receive an abstract. Kind regards, Peter Mill. ----- Original Message ----- From: Cosmin O. Manci To: westpalodos AT yahoogroups.com Cc: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Sent: Friday, February 03, 2012 12:30 PM Subject: [WestPalOdos] PhD thesis abstract romanian dreagonflies Dear all, Now I have just finished my PhD thesis on Romanian dragonflies and working on the abstract (will be also one in english). I have to complete a list of at least 20 persons/specialists in the field that received the abstract. If someone is interested to receive the abstract (as pdf) can you please name yourself... so I can do also that list :) . I know that some of you want this but will be easier for me if you let me know it again. Today or tomorrow will end it so will be available for sending. Thank you and all my best, Cosmin _______________________________________________________ Cosmin-Ovidiu Manci biologist & photographer ********************** http://cosmln.nature4stock.com - cosmln's place http://dragonfly.nature4stock.com - Dragonflies of Romania http://birds.nature4stock.com - Birds of Romania http://mybiosis.info/nature/portal.php?pagename=firstpage - a romanian flora & fauna database and not only ********************** DSLR Collecting Saves Lives! ********************** " Only after the last tree has been cut down, only after the last river has been poisoned, only after the last fish has been caught, only then will you find that money can not be eaten. " an old indian saying __._,_.___ Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (1) Recent Activity: Visit Your Group Switch to: Text-Only, Daily Digest . Unsubscribe . Terms of Use. __,_._,__________________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: PhD thesis abstract romanian dreagonflies From: "Cosmin O. Manci" <cosminovidiu AT yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 3 Feb 2012 04:30:35 -0800 Dear all, Now I have just finished my PhD thesis on Romanian dragonflies and working on the abstract (will be also one in english). I have to complete a list of at least 20 persons/specialists in the field that received the abstract. If someone is interested to receive the abstract (as pdf) can you please name yourself... so I can do also that list :) . I know that some of you want this but will be easier for me if you let me know it again. Today or tomorrow will end it so will be available for sending. Thank you and all my best,  Cosmin _______________________________________________________ Cosmin-Ovidiu Manci biologist & photographer ********************** http://cosmln.nature4stock.com - cosmln's place http://dragonfly.nature4stock.com - Dragonflies of Romania http://birds.nature4stock.com - Birds of Romania http://mybiosis.info/nature/portal.php?pagename=firstpage - a romanian flora & fauna database and not only ********************** DSLR Collecting Saves Lives! ********************** " Only after the last tree has been cut down, only after the last river has been poisoned, only after the last fish has been caught, only then will you find that money can not be eaten. " an old indian saying _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Fwd: [se-odonata] ASSISTANCE REQUIRED FOR THE IDENTIFICATION OF ODONATA NAIADS From: Joshua Rose <opihi AT mindspring.com> Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2012 14:25:48 -0500 In case anyone can help this person from Pakistan out..... JSR Joshua Rose, Ph.D. Amherst, MA opihi AT mindspring.com http://bugguide.net/user/view/2399 http://www.facebook.com/opihi Begin forwarded message: > From: amad khan > Date: February 2, 2012 9:34:53 AM EST > To: se-odonata AT yahoogroups.com > Subject: [se-odonata] ASSISTANCE REQUIRED FOR THE IDENTIFICATION OF ODONATA NAIADS > > > > Dear Sir, > > I am Amad from Pakistan. I am working on species composition of Odonata naiads in comparison to water composition/quality in Potohar Region of Pakistan. > > Sir, in our country we have access to limmited resources over internet and because of this i am unable to download some valuable literature regarding cited research. Also in our country no such study has ever been carried out in the past. > > I therefore request you to help me out in this condition of literature shortage. I need identification keys with the help of which i can identify odonata naiads upto species level. > > kindly if possible send me any relevant literature in soft or hard form. > > I will be very thankful to you for this act of kindness. > > ; Your's Truely > Amad Ud Din > > > __._,_.___ > > > Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional > Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) > Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured > Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe > > __,_._,___ _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Head vibrations in Aesha species (Erland Nielsen) From: Martha Smith <scldrgnfly AT gmail.com> Date: Tue, 31 Jan 2012 16:09:56 -0500 What a beautiful picture and an amazing story! In all my years of videotaping every summer, since 2001, I do not think I have seen what you have described. Could the temperatures have dropped significantly on those dates? Have there been any possible toxins applied to the vegetation, seepage of toxins into the water in the area? I do have lots of footage recording quick head movements which I slow down to see what exactly is happening at the time, but I don't think any of the movements have lasted for as long a period as you have seen them. I would wonder about the sluggishness of the dragonflies and the almost seizure-like movement of the dragonflies' heads. The only time I have seen prolonged vibrating seizure-like, mainly whole-body movement, has been when I have rescued several dragonflies from drowning. Funny thing, some actually made it, being back the next day, and many more. I really haven't noticed much of a change in our dragonfly population since they have started spraying for mosquitoes in our neighborhood, but our droughts have taken their tolls on the population. I would imagine that in Denmark, as far north as it is, you could have abrupt temperature drops when the sun is still high enough for the dragonflies to see to couple (getting near the time of sun 24 hours). You could check those dates to see if the temperature dropped on the dates they began their reproductive behavior. Is that what we call "snake grass" that they are perched on? Does it have any toxic properties? I Googled "snake grass," Equisetum and found this link. Depending on where the other dragonflies were filmed, it would be interesting to check out whether herbicides were used on this area of vegetation because it seems to be treated as a nuisance plant. The article also mentions that while humans do eat it after careful preparation, it can be toxic to horses. Also, the stems have a fine coating of silicates on them. Are dragonflies sensitive to ingesting silicates? This is cool, if you are a woodworker, the Japanese still boil this down to produce a substance that can polish wood better than any sandpaper. Here is the link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equisetum Martha Edwards Smith P.S. I was thinking about your use of the word old, and I hate to wax "anthropomorphic" on you, LOL!, but just from past experience, a lot of the really torn up dragonflies, aren't really very old, they are just a lot more experienced! Ha! Ha!--bordering on Alpha's! Yeah! That's right, those of us that are looking a bit old are really the Alpha's of the group! Ha! Ha! I guess you all know, I dream A lot!_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Head vibrations in Aesha species From: Erland Nielsen <e_refling AT yahoo.com> Date: Mon, 30 Jan 2012 13:02:47 -0800 This post is about my observations of rapid head movements in Aeshna species. Both observations was made in Denmark, first of Aeshna cyanea and the second of Aeshna grandis. I have not seen any other descriptions of similar observations, and since 2005 when I did see it for the first time, I have speculated on what was the cause. Now in 2011 I saw it again, and this time with much more intense movements. On the 15th of October 2005 I found a male Aeshna cyanea perched low in the vegetation. A seemingly old individual, at least based on the worn wings. I was able to photograph it very close, even with wide angle lens, meaning that I was close to, if not touching the dragonflies wings at some point. While looking at the dragonfly, maybe too minutes into the observation, the dragonfly started to vibrate the head. I am not entirely sure which axis is rotated around, but it may have been mostly around the axis running down the dragonflies body, meaning it was a twisting rotation of the head. These rotations was done twice, each time lasting maybe two seconds, with a head movement frequency of 5-10/s. There was a short break of maybe 5 seconds between the two vibration durations. Here a picture of the aeshnid: http://flic.kr/p/8KBiBp Now six years later I'm out in the morning on the 6th of August 2011, looking for Aeshna viridis at a good location. At 8 A.M. I find a "sleeping" mating wheel which must have formed the day before, and have stayed together during the night. This is how they were perched, the male must have lost its grip in the vegetation during the night, and have "dropped" down: http://flic.kr/p/aaNP2v Mating wheels being maintained through the night is interesting, but is not the subject here. Head vibrations is, but a mating wheel lead me to my next observation. I start hearing wing rattles from the vegetation (maybe a meter high) around me, as I walk around looking for more dragonflies. The dragonflies are obviously "waking up". Loud and lasting wing rattles lead me to a pair of Aeshna grandis in tandem, where seemingly the female is trying to free itself from the males grip. Here is the couple, photographed at 8:55 A.M. and again I suspect this must be a pair which has spent the night together in mating wheel: http://flic.kr/p/ac6CBr Shortly after the picture was taken, the female flew of, while the male stayed in more or less the position its in in the picture. I dropped my camera gear and picked up the male by the wings. Holding the male, hawing a close look at it, it curled the abdomen etc. showing that it was not "happy" to be constrained. Now suddenly, while it was more or less calm, with the body held straight, it started to vibrate the head at such a high frequency that it emitted a sound. It did it twice, both times lasting maybe 3-4 seconds. I must say I nearly "dropped" the dragonfly in amazement. The rotation of the head was this time surely more or less a twist rotation, maybe with an amplitude of 10-20 degrees and with a very high frequency. The movements was so rapid that more or less the whole body of the dragonfly vibrated, and the sound may not have come directly from the head or the neck of the dragonfly. Now my question is, why did these two males vibrate the head ? I suspect that the last incidence with the very high frequency by the Aeshna grandis, was the dragonfly trying to "scare" the predator (in this case just harmless me), trying to avoid getting eaten. I can see no other explanation. The Aeshna cyanea that I photographed  in 2005 for several minutes, may likewise have tried to scare me away. Has anyone ever observed anything similar ? Or maybe see another explanation to these observations I've made ? Erland R. Nielsen Denmark_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Chrysobasis lucifer article in Ft Myers Newspaper From: IORI <iodonata AT bellsouth.net> Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2012 08:10:48 -0500 Here is an article about our Lebtobasis adventure that ran today: http://www.news-press.com/article/20120128/GREEN/301280039/Damselfly-has-lan ded-here?odyssey=tab|topnews|img|Home Bill Mauffray International Odonata Research Institute PO Box 147100 Gainesville FL 32614-7100 352-219-3141 cell iodonata AT gmail.com http://www.iodonata.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Chrysobasis lucifer article in Ft Myers Newspaper From: "IORI" <iodonata AT bellsouth.net> Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2012 08:10:48 -0500 Here is an article about our Lebtobasis adventure that ran today: http://www.news-press.com/article/20120128/GREEN/301280039/Damselfly-has-lan ded-here?odyssey=tab|topnews|img|Home Bill Mauffray International Odonata Research Institute PO Box 147100 Gainesville FL 32614-7100 352-219-3141 cell iodonata AT gmail.com http://www.iodonata.net Subject: Chrysobasis lucifer article in Ft Myers Newspaper From: "IORI" <iodonata AT bellsouth.net> Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2012 08:10:48 -0500 Here is an article about our Lebtobasis adventure that ran today: http://www.news-press.com/article/20120128/GREEN/301280039/Damselfly-has-lan ded-here?odyssey=tab|topnews|img|Home Bill Mauffray International Odonata Research Institute PO Box 147100 Gainesville FL 32614-7100 352-219-3141 cell iodonata AT gmail.com http://www.iodonata.net Subject: Chrysobasis lucifer article in Ft Myers Newspaper From: "IORI" <iodonata AT bellsouth.net> Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2012 08:10:48 -0500 Here is an article about our Lebtobasis adventure that ran today: http://www.news-press.com/article/20120128/GREEN/301280039/Damselfly-has-lan ded-here?odyssey=tab|topnews|img|Home Bill Mauffray International Odonata Research Institute PO Box 147100 Gainesville FL 32614-7100 352-219-3141 cell iodonata AT gmail.com http://www.iodonata.net Subject: Re: Head and Eye movement of Libellula vibrans as it is about to take off RE: "Socially Interactive" behaviors of the Libellula vibrans, Libellula lydia, Erythemis simplicicollis and Pachydi[plax longipennis From: Martha Smith <scldrgnfly AT gmail.com> Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2012 04:42:59 -0500 I forgot to mention in the previous post that another reason I wanted you to see the slow motion view of the L.v.'s take-off was to see the subtle movement of the dragonfly's eyes and head before it made its move. Thank you, Martha Edwards Smith_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: "Socially Interactive" behaviors of the Libellula vibrans, Libellula lydia, Erythemis simplicicollis and Pachydi[plax longipennis From: Martha Smith <scldrgnfly AT gmail.com> Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2012 04:35:50 -0500 I was wondering as I started to go through my dragonfly videos, if anyone has had the same "socially interactive" experiences with the Erythemis simplicicollis, Libellula lydia, Libellula vibrans and Pachydiplax longipennis? The Erythemis simplicicollis (female, mostly) will follow me around the yard, with the Erythemis simplicicollis being what I would call the sweetest. It will land on the bricks around my steps and when I come down into the drive and yard it will follow me around staying low to the ground landing on the grass around my ankles or on low to waist high branches. It seems to have a kind of fluid, in flight manner of "socializing," with perching momentarily as part of its pattern. It also seems to prefer focusing on me with it's dorsally viewed pseudopupil. They are so wide open as I look down on it, or videotape. This is also the same species that was picking off gnats from my legs at one of my daughter's tennis matches. I had felt little bumps against the backs of my legs and then I saw these girls looking at me and laughing and they told me what the dragonfly was doing. At the time, the same dragonfly found a twig on the ground between my legs and would sit on it when munching. I hated I only had my phone camera, because it wasn't good enough to upload for all of you. However I do have several videos to upload of this species following me around. The Libellula lydia (female, mostly) will land on the ground, branches and porch railings near me as I walk, and so it has sort of a fly and perch method of "socializing." If one is in the yard and I am out, it will make a point of landing nearby on the ground or up to about chest high and then it will fly up and land again seeming to try to capture my attention. It will stay for a bit while I talk to it, but then it goes about whatever it does, while the Erythemis simplicicollis will just hang with me, either preceding or following, landing on the grass or a branch as we move around. The Pachydiplax longipennis (both female and male) will follow me around, but perches on low to chest high branches while I walk. It really seems to be a "percher." While it does like to stay on certain perches similar to the Libellula vibrans, it will move around the yard with me. Of all the dragonflies in our area, it seems to be the most ubiquitous. The Libellula vibrans (male, mostly)seems to be the most attached to certain perches in the yard and it will sit and stay on one for quite a while. They will follow us to the door to the house or car when we leave the pool area and will sit outside our kitchen window and back door perched so they can see in. They also have a perch just beyond the tall bushes that separate the front from the backyard where the pool is, but in each case they prefer to stay put, unless shifting their lookout for, I think females. Maybe their vision has much greater peripheral capabilities than the other species that follow me around more closely. What I think is most interesting is the fact that there is a break in our bushes that allows for the Libellula vibrans to see our side door, if it is perched at just the right place on the rope that has been above our pool for the past 16 years (replaced once, so far). At times, when I make videos of them, they allow me to get so close that I almost touch the tip of their wing near the pterostigma. It's unfortunate that I haven't been able to do this with a tripod or monopod yet. It is just too much to go on that close to them. Here is the first video of one of those close-ups. I did three versions, a real-time short version, a slow motion short version and a long slow motion version. In the real-time version you can hardly see the first time the dragonfly takes off. It's almost the time of a blink of an eye. The long version shows how tolerant the dragonfly is with my clumsy efforts to focus on it. Frankly, even the long version has quite a bit edited out of the tape: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRNMlAh73Jw&feature=related I hate to say this, but wait till you see the Erythemis simplicicollis videos. They really have a sweet nature about them. They just seem very delicate in their manner of presence and flight._______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Fwd: Aquatic Entomology Seminar at Eagle Hill From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2012 14:52:23 -0800 Begin forwarded message: > ------ Forwarded Message > From: "anne AT eaglehill.us" > Date: Wed, 25 Jan 2012 12:05:41 -0800 > To: Dennis R Paulson > Subject: Aquatic Entomology Seminar at Eagle Hill > > Hello Dennis, > We wanted to keep you in the loop about the upcoming aquatic entomology seminar being held at Eagle Hill this summer. We are hoping that you will be able to send an announcement via the odonate listserv. Let me know if you are able to do this, or if I should be in contact with someone else. > > Thank you. > Best wishes, > Anne > > Aquatic Entomology Seminar Offered by the Humboldt Institute > > Aquatic Entomology - July 29 - August 4 with Steven K. Burian > > Descriptions of seminars may be found at http://www.eaglehill.us/programs/nhs/nhs-calendar.shtml > Information on lodging options, meals, and costs may be found at http://www.eaglehill.us/programs/general/application-info.shtml > > There is an online application form at > http://www.eaglehill.us/programs/general/application-web.shtml > > Syllabi are available for these and many other fine natural history training seminars on diverse topics. > > For more information, please contact the Humboldt Institute, PO Box 9, Steuben, ME 04680-0009. > 207-546-2821. Fax 207-546-3042 > E-mail - office AT eaglehill.us > Online general information may be found at http://www.eaglehill.us > > > -- > Announcement and Invitation ... Northeast Natural History Conference 2012 ... Syracuse, NY, April 15-19 > > A prime regional forum for networking about natural history research ... http://www.eaglehill.us/NENHC_2012/NENHC2012 > > Anne Favolise, Administrative Assistant > Humboldt Field Research Institute and Eagle Hill Foundation > PO Box 9, 59 Eagle Hill Road, Steuben, ME 04680-0009 United States > Phone: 207-546-2821, FAX: 207-546-3042, http://www.eaglehill.us > > > Publishers of three science journals. > > Northeastern Naturalist: > www.eaglehill.us/nena > > Southeastern Naturalist: > www.eaglehill.us/sena > > Journal of the North Atlantic: > www.eaglehill.us/jona > > > ------ End of Forwarded Message ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Membranule? From: Colin Adams <colinpauladams AT gmail.com> Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2012 06:18:39 +0000 There's a brief mention of it in Guenter Bechly's 1996 thesis. It's available from his website ( http://www.bernstein.naturkundemuseum-bw.de/odonata/gbechly.htm). If you don't read German, here's a rather poor translation (I'm slowly translating it using Google translate to do most of the hard work, as I don't read German at all fluently): :1.) Membranule: The Membranule (= "wing membrane) is a flexible, transparent membrane with milky grained structure (Fig. 14-16th, 29th, 33rd, 35th, 39th, 40th and 78th). The structuring of taxa seems to be partially different for the different Anisoptera, but was not investigated in this work, scanning electron microscopy. The Membranule runs in the forewing the Anisoptera from the base of the anal margin Analis (dorsum). The same is true for the Hind wings, where the anal margin is of a particularly clear and the basal side of the anal triangle forms (except Anactini, Hemicordulia, Macrodiplacidae and Libellulidae). at some Anisoptera Membranule only the distal portion of the membrane is a narrow strip trained so that they well before the end of the posterior end of anal triangle seems. The Membranule is in continuous connection with the Axillary band and thus also the articular membrane which it resembles in structure very much. The Membranule is therefore the most plausible as a secondary extension of the membrane-articular view, the posterior axillary area with the basal wing trailing edge ("trailing edge") tense (Newman, 1982: 131) and possibly a substantial role in the active supination the wing on impact plays. For most Zygoptera extends a narrow strip of membranous approach Axillary the belt at the Analisbasis along the anal rim until the beginning of the thorn double row. This membrane strip at the Euphaeidae and Calopterygidae particularly well trained. It is milky-transparent and has a granular structure. very Therefore, this is probably homologous with the membrane strips Membranule the Anisoptera. When the leaf stalks Zygoptera he is probably only less pronounced, because it was reduced by training the petiole. When the alleged Membranule of Megatypus ("Protodonata" Meganeuridae) (Tillyard, 1925a), it is likely to be a true, of longitudinal veins (JA and JP) infused wing box, the jugual vein of the Neoptera should be homologous (Riek & KUKALOVA-Peck, 1984). On 27 January 2012 05:07, Guillon wrote: > Hello,**** > > I'm looking for the function of the membranule, at the basis of the wing > of the anisopteras.**** > > Have they a precise role? **** > > I' don't know if there are any hypothesis about this white coloured cell?* > *** > > ** ** > > Thank you.**** > > ** ** > > Benoît Guillon.**** > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > >_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Membranule? From: Guillon <benoit.guillon AT meslibellules.fr> Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2012 06:07:18 +0100 Hello, I'm looking for the function of the membranule, at the basis of the wing of the anisopteras. Have they a precise role? I' don't know if there are any hypothesis about this white coloured cell? Thank you. Benoît Guillon._______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: thanks for the photos From: Marc Tailly <marc.tailly AT pandora.be> Date: Wed, 25 Jan 2012 20:22:35 +0100 Cosmin, I would be glad to receive the english part/. Marc Tailly marc.tailly AT pandora.be ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cosmin O. Manci" To: Cc: Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2012 11:51 PM Subject: [Odonata-l] thanks for the photos Dear all, Thank you very much for all the help with photos. Have all of them for now, when the abstract of the PhD (the one in english) is over will send that also to all that are interested in this material. All my best, Cosmin _______________________________________________________ Cosmin-Ovidiu Manci biologist & photographer ********************** http://cosmln.nature4stock.com - cosmln's place http://dragonfly.nature4stock.com - Dragonflies of Romania http://birds.nature4stock.com - Birds of Romania http://mybiosis.info/nature/portal.php?pagename=firstpage - a romanian flora & fauna database and not only ********************** DSLR Collecting Saves Lives! ********************** " Only after the last tree has been cut down, only after the last river has been poisoned, only after the last fish has been caught, only then will you find that money can not be eaten. " an old indian saying _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: thanks for the photos From: "Cosmin O. Manci" <cosminovidiu AT yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 24 Jan 2012 14:51:18 -0800 Dear all, Thank you very much for all the help with photos. Have all of them for now, when the abstract of the PhD (the one in english) is over will send that also to all that are interested in this material. All my best, Cosmin _______________________________________________________ Cosmin-Ovidiu Manci biologist & photographer ********************** http://cosmln.nature4stock.com - cosmln's place http://dragonfly.nature4stock.com - Dragonflies of Romania http://birds.nature4stock.com - Birds of Romania http://mybiosis.info/nature/portal.php?pagename=firstpage - a romanian flora & fauna database and not only ********************** DSLR Collecting Saves Lives! ********************** " Only after the last tree has been cut down, only after the last river has been poisoned, only after the last fish has been caught, only then will you find that money can not be eaten. " an old indian saying _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 95, Issue 18 From: <rgs455 AT cox.net> Date: Tue, 24 Jan 2012 17:47:15 -0500 Jason, Welcome to the Orangist state in America! If you haven't done so already you should join the Texas Odes list since that's where most of the Okie Oders hang out. I'll send you some OK contacts this evening when I get home though be warned that some of them work at that other university. John ---- odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu wrote: > Send Odonata-l mailing list submissions to > odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu > > You can reach the person managing the list at > odonata-l-owner AT listhost.ups.edu > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Odonata-l digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. new contact info (Jason Bried) > 2. Puerto Rico and odonates (George L. Harp) > 3. Thailand odes (jeremy gatten) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 23 Jan 2012 09:43:01 -0600 > From: Jason Bried > Subject: [Odonata-l] new contact info > To: > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Hi, > > Just wanted to inform you that I have moved from New York and my new > affiliation/contact info is below. I look forward to exploring the odes of > Oklahoma. If anyone on the list is local let me know if you want to do some > ode chasing when things start flying. > > -- > Jason Bried > Department of Zoology > Oklahoma State University > 501 Life Sciences West > Stillwater, OK 74078 > bried AT okstate.edu > 518-698-1257 > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20120123/ad931907/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 23 Jan 2012 16:05:29 -0600 > From: "George L. Harp" > Subject: [Odonata-l] Puerto Rico and odonates > To: "Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu" > Message-ID: > <6FE728AEDD5DB44B940A5020D3119F9E01C66F128F95 AT MBX.astate.edu> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Hi, > > I am communicating with a marine biologist who has taken several class groups to Puerto Rico. I have visited with him about my going there to become familiar with PR odonates. He has told me of a place to stay in the rain forest, but he doesn't know anything about odonates. Would PR be a good place to go? Any tips on where to go, stay, etc.? > > Thanks, > > George Harp > glharp AT astate.edu > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Mon, 23 Jan 2012 22:50:01 +0000 > From: jeremy gatten > Subject: [Odonata-l] Thailand odes > To: > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > > Hi all, > For those interested, I just posted a little blog entry on the odonates I encountered in Thailand in February last year. It's basically just a brief intro and then lots of pictures. If anyone has any alternate suggestions on identifications, please drop me a line! The blog entry is found here: > http://naturalestnaturalist.blogspot.com/2012/01/thailand-odonata.html > Enjoy,Jeremy GattenVictoria, B.C. > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20120123/f3f890e4/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > > End of Odonata-l Digest, Vol 95, Issue 18 > ***************************************** _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Thailand odes From: jeremy gatten <jarofme AT hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 23 Jan 2012 22:50:01 +0000 Hi all, For those interested, I just posted a little blog entry on the odonates I encountered in Thailand in February last year. It's basically just a brief intro and then lots of pictures. If anyone has any alternate suggestions on identifications, please drop me a line! The blog entry is found here: http://naturalestnaturalist.blogspot.com/2012/01/thailand-odonata.html Enjoy,Jeremy GattenVictoria, B.C. _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Puerto Rico and odonates From: "George L. Harp" <glharp AT astate.edu> Date: Mon, 23 Jan 2012 16:05:29 -0600 Hi, I am communicating with a marine biologist who has taken several class groups to Puerto Rico. I have visited with him about my going there to become familiar with PR odonates. He has told me of a place to stay in the rain forest, but he doesn't know anything about odonates. Would PR be a good place to go? Any tips on where to go, stay, etc.? Thanks, George Harp glharp AT astate.edu _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: new contact info From: Jason Bried <bried AT okstate.edu> Date: Mon, 23 Jan 2012 09:43:01 -0600 Hi, Just wanted to inform you that I have moved from New York and my new affiliation/contact info is below. I look forward to exploring the odes of Oklahoma. If anyone on the list is local let me know if you want to do some ode chasing when things start flying. -- Jason Bried Department of Zoology Oklahoma State University 501 Life Sciences West Stillwater, OK 74078 bried AT okstate.edu 518-698-1257_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: (no subject) From: "Cosmin O. Manci" <cosminovidiu AT yahoo.com> Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 22:27:50 -0800 Dear all, Thank you very much for all your help.  This is year if all go well will work on a new monograph on romanian dragonfly fauna, and hope that in 2013 will be out. Because here are no funds probably will go directly as an e-book (now almost anyone has a smart/tough phone with big screen or a tablet). Now only for one species a photo is missing, Aeshna viridis... somebody? All my best, Cosmin _______________________________________________________ Cosmin-Ovidiu Manci biologist & photographer ********************** http://cosmln.nature4stock.com - cosmln's place http://dragonfly.nature4stock.com - Dragonflies of Romania http://birds.nature4stock.com - Birds of Romania http://mybiosis.info/nature/portal.php?pagename=firstpage - a romanian flora & fauna database and not only ********************** DSLR Collecting Saves Lives! ********************** " Only after the last tree has been cut down, only after the last river has been poisoned, only after the last fish has been caught, only then will you find that money can not be eaten. " an old indian saying _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Erythrodiplax plates From: Rosser Garrison <rosser.garrison AT cdfa.ca.gov> Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2012 13:00:54 -0800 Rhainer, I'm in Argentina but will see what I have upon my return (8 February). I may forget by the time I return so please remind me.... Cheers, Rosser ________________________________ From: rhainer guillermo [mailto:rhainerguillermo AT yahoo.com.br] Sent: Fri 1/20/2012 8:27 AM To: Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Subject: Erythrodiplax plates Dear colleagues I'm writing to ask a favor. Can someone share the plates for these species? Mainly penis and hamuli. Erythrodiplax anomala Brauer, 1865 E. branconensis Sjostedt, 1929 E. bromeliicola Westfall, 2000 E. diversa Navas, 1916 E. erratica Erichson, 1848 E. melanica Thank you very much, Rhainer _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Erythrodiplax plates From: rhainer guillermo <rhainerguillermo AT yahoo.com.br> Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2012 08:27:19 -0800 Dear colleagues I'm writing to ask a favor. Can someone share the plates for these species? Mainly penis and hamuli. Erythrodiplax anomala Brauer, 1865 E. branconensis Sjostedt, 1929 E. bromeliicola Westfall, 2000 E. diversa Navas, 1916 E. erratica Erichson, 1848 E. melanica Thank you very much, Rhainer _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: help with photo From: "Cosmin O. Manci" <cosminovidiu AT yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2012 15:43:14 -0800 Dear all, I have to end with my PhD thesis on Romanian dragonfly fauna and need some help with some photos. This are species for what only historical records are known from Romania, misidentified/misrecorded species and some probable species to be found in future. I need one photo preferably in landscape orientation, 1000 pixels long line and preferably a male, in nature/not in hand. I'm unable to pay anything for them and the photos will be used to illustrate an internal document, my PhD thesis (will be printed in 4 exemplary). The credits for the photos will go to you and you will remembered in Acknowledgments. The species of interest are: Sympecma paedisca (Brauer, 1882) Ceriagrion tenellum (de Villers, 1789) Coenagrion armatum (Charpentier, 1840) Coenagrion caerulescens (Fonscolombe, 1838) Coenagrion hastulatum (Charpentier, 1825) Coenagrion mercuriale (Charpentier, 1840) Erythromma najas (Hansemann, 1823) Aeshna caerulea (Stroem, 1783) Aeshna grandis (Linnaeus, 1758) Aeshna subarctica Walker, 1908 Aeshna viridis Eversmann, 1836 Gomphus flavipes (Charpentier, 1825) Gomphus pulchellus Selys, 1840 Onychogomphus uncatus (Charpentier, 1840) Cordulegaster boltonii (Donovan, 1807) Crocothemis servilia (Drury, 1773) Leucorrhinia caudalis (Charpentier, 1840) Leucorrhinia pectoralis (Charpentier, 1825) Sympetrum flaveolum (Linnaeus, 1758) Thank you very much, Cosmin  _______________________________________________________ Cosmin-Ovidiu Manci biologist & photographer ********************** http://cosmln.nature4stock.com - cosmln's place http://dragonfly.nature4stock.com - Dragonflies of Romania http://birds.nature4stock.com - Birds of Romania http://mybiosis.info/nature/portal.php?pagename=firstpage - a romanian flora & fauna database and not only ********************** DSLR Collecting Saves Lives! ********************** " Only after the last tree has been cut down, only after the last river has been poisoned, only after the last fish has been caught, only then will you find that money can not be eaten. " an old indian saying _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Looking for Odonata photos for a field guide From: Erik Hirschfeld <troll AT hirschfeldmedia.com> Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2012 13:44:58 +0100 Hello, I am publishing a not-for-profit, Swedish-language field guide to Scandinavian dragonflies in April. It consists of c 350 photos organized in identification plates of 72 species, aside from identification tables and text. Profits from sales go to nature conservation and I work, finance and publish this as a hobby. It will be the first complete field guide to Scandinavian dragonflies, which is very much needed. Only a few photos remain to secure and I wonder whether any subscribers have the species listed below and would be willing to contribute. Photography angles should preferably be from straight above or straight from the side. Photos should be taken in the field and not be of hand-held dragonflies. Published photographers will of course get a free guide and can have a website included in their photo credits. If you have photos and are willing to participate, please email me low resolution jpgs. I will then get back to you and ask for high resolution of those images I finally select. Contact me et erik AT hirschfeldmedia.com and please spread this to anyone outside of the group who may be interested. Kind regards, Erik Erik Hirschfeld, Malmo, Sweden erik AT hirschfeldmedia.com Pygmy Damselfly Nehalennia speciosa Female above Green Hawker Aeshna viridis Female side River Clubtail Gomphus flavipes Female above Treeline Emerald Somatochlora sahlbergi Female above. Yellow-spotted Emerald Somatochlora flavomaculata Female side. Eurasian Baskettail Epitheca bimaculata Female side. Ruby Whiteface Leucorrhinia rubicunda Male side. Common Darter Sympetrum striolatum Teneral female above Northern Emerald Somatochlora arctica Male side. Arctic Bluet Coenagrion johanssoni Female above Coenagrion hylas and C. glaciale Any images _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: International Journal of Odonatology is Calling for Papers From: Taylor Francis <kayleigh.hellin AT tandf.co.uk> Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 12:14:05 +0000 Dear Colleague, International Journal of Odonatology is calling for papers. http://pharmaprojects.msgfocus.com/c/177OXooFc5OEAVTX8uuSiNC7I International Journal of Odonatology is aimed at providing a publication outlet for the growing number of students of Odonata. It will address subjects such as the ecology, ethology, physiology, genetics, taxonomy, phylogeny and geographic distribution of species. Reviews will be by invitation, but authors who plan to write a review on a subject of interest to the journal are encouraged to contact the editor. ----- New to T&F for 2011 A publication of the Worldwide Dragonfly Association http://pharmaprojects.msgfocus.com/c/177OXKSMMld9AKvYdmrs5YLdR 2010 Impact Factor: 0.791 © 2011 Thomson Reuters, 2010 JCR ® EDITOR: Michael L. May, Department of Entomology, Rutgers University, NJ, USA ----- Why submit your paper? Papers published online within 7 weeks of acceptance!*. iFirst - Taylor & Francis' proprietary early online-publication system. This means that your articles will be available to read and cite prior to the print publication. Please visit our Author Services webpage for further information. http://pharmaprojects.msgfocus.com/c/177OY7mUmABEAz7Zieo1T9Uk0 * Based on average acceptance to publication dates for Issue 14(2) ----- Submissions: All submissions All submissions should be sent by email to the Editor, Michael L. May, may AT aesop.Rutgers.edu "may AT aesop.Rutgers.edu"::mailto:may AT aesop.Rutgers.edu. Further information can be found on the ‘Instructions for Authors page. http://pharmaprojects.msgfocus.com/c/177OYtR1WQ09AnK0n6kBGl3q9’ We look forward to receiving your submissions. ----- Free Access: To give you an insight into this title, we are offering free online access to the first issue published by Taylor & Francis, Volume 14, Issue 1. 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Please note this is an automated operation. http://pharmaprojects.msgfocus.com/u/11wVOnSk4M51fG5w_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 08:02:47 -0800 Here is a complicated and very educational response to extreme nature faking in a National Geographic photo, forwarded from Tom Schultz. I know this is getting way beyond dragonflies closing their wings, and I hope there are many photographers and bird and insect aficionados on the list who don't mind this thread. Dennis Begin forwarded message: > From: Thomas Schultz > Date: January 9, 2012 7:44:03 PM PST > To: Dennis Paulson > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Fwd: dragonfly closes wings > > Dennis, > > Pertinent to your comments, here is a story regarding NG photographs from a few years ago. > > http://www.naturephoto.hu/natgeo_english/index.html > > Tom_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings From: Sherry McCowan <mccowan AT swbell.net> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 07:47:21 -0600 I should add that they don't object to the kind of post-procession that Ellis mentions. On Jan 10, 2012, at 7:45 AM, Sherry McCowan wrote: > Just took a look at the Nat Geo rules, which include a link to the > following "comments on image manipulation": > > "Please submit photographs that are un-manipulated and real, and > that capture those special moments in time. The world is already > full of visual artifice, and we don’t want the National Geographic > Photography Contest to add to it. We want to see the world through > your eyes, not the tools of Photoshop or setup photography." > > _____________________ > Sherry McCowan > Saint Louis, Missouri > mccowan AT swbell.net > > On Jan 10, 2012, at 6:41 AM, Laudermilk, Ellis (EEC) wrote: > >> I spend a fair amount of time reading the opinions of professional >> nature photographers and most of them only approve of "fake" photos >> when the photographer clearly identifies that major elements of the >> photo were manipulated or staged. I’m not talking about minor post- >> processing of exposure, white balance, etc., since that is commonly >> done. I’m talking about something more egregious. For example, >> capturing a photo of an animal in captivity and then claiming the >> photo was taken in the wild under natural conditions is unethical. >> You may recall an example of a photographer being stripped of his >> prize for that very reason. If not, read about it here with a >> photo here. The rules of the competition will define what is >> acceptable. I haven’t read the rules of Nat Geo competition, but I >> suspect they were judging this photo based on the photographer’s >> description, which as Marion points out states he captured what >> nature presented. >> >> Ellis Laudermilk >> >> Kentucky >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu >> ] On Behalf Of Marion Dobbs >> Sent: Monday, January 09, 2012 9:44 PM >> To: Odonata List Server >> Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings >> >> While "nature-faking" may be acceptable in a given competition, >> deliberate misrepresentation should not. The photographer clearly >> states that sudden rain and beautiful lighting, combined with his >> sudden awareness of a perfect photographable subject, produced this >> serendipitous prize-winner. >> >> >> Marion Dobbs >> >> 9 Bridlewood Lane >> >> Rome GA 30165 >> >> ecurlew AT mac.com >> >> http://www.mamomi.net >> >> http://mamomi.smugmug.com >> >> "All science is either physics or stamp collecting." _Ernest >> Rutherford >> >> On Jan 9, 2012, at 7:24 PM, Dennis Paulson wrote: >> >> > Interestingly, Fred Lencioni just emailed me that he thought it >> didn't matter, that what counted for this competition was the >> photo, not how it was set up. As long as there was no post- >> processing modifications, "nature faking" was all right. I don't >> know if that's true or not, but it is something to be considered. >> >> > >> >> > His nature faking certainly set up quite a discussion based on >> its being real. That also is something to think about. Can we use >> online photos of dragonflies as data points for behavior, habitat, >> etc.,, or do we need to exercise caution? >> >> > >> >> > Dennis >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > On Jan 9, 2012, at 3:48 PM, Mike Ferro wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> If you visit his website a lot of his photos seem to be staged >> (or are >> >> >> at least incredibly improbable) and he has numerous photos of >> insects >> >> >> covered in condensation. http://500px.com/shikhei >> >> >> >> >> >> There are four photos of rain on dragonflies: >> >> >> >> >> >> Same perch: >> >> >> http://500px.com/photo/3000362 >> >> >> http://500px.com/photo/3963219 >> >> >> >> >> >> Different perches: >> >> >> http://500px.com/photo/2129340 >> >> >> http://500px.com/photo/2457760 >> >> >> >> >> >> And one dragon without rain: >> >> >> http://500px.com/photo/1493103 >> >> >> >> >> >> The rain drops seem too fine to me. Can anyone find an example >> of a >> >> >> macro photo of rain that reproduces that effect? Additionally the >> >> >> angle of the spray (see http://500px.com/photo/2457760) is >> consistent >> >> >> with Dennis's hypothesized spritzer. >> >> >> >> >> >> They are beautiful photos, but they shouldn't be passed off as >> real if >> >> >> they are staged. >> >> >> >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> >> >> >> >> Mike >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, Jan 9, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Dennis Paulson >> >> >> wrote: >> >> >>> Again, from K. D. B. Dijkstra. >> >> >>> >> >> >>> Begin forwarded message: >> >> >>> >> >> >>> From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." >> >> >>> Date: January 9, 2012 2:05:02 PM PST >> >> >>> To: Dennis Paulson >> >> >>> Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] Fwd: dragonfly closes wings >> >> >>> >> >> >>> Hi Dennis, >> >> >>> >> >> >>> The photograper said this about his winner: >> >> >>> >> >> >>> "I wasn’t actually aware of this dragonfly since I was occupied >> with other >> >> >>> objects. When I was about to take a picture of it, it suddenly >> rained, but >> >> >>> the lighting was just superb. I decided to take the shot >> regardless of the >> >> >>> rain. The result caused me to be overjoyed, and I hope it >> pleases viewers." >> >> >>> >> >> >>> That doesn't agree with having three different individuals with >> the same >> >> >>> superb light and sudden rain... >> >> >>> >> >> >>> Cheers, KD >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >> >>> Odonata-l mailing list >> >> >>> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >> >> >>> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l >> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> >> Odonata-l mailing list >> >> >> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >> >> >> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l >> >> > >> >> > ----- >> >> > Dennis Paulson >> >> > 1724 NE 98 St. >> >> > Seattle, WA 98115 >> >> > 206-528-1382 >> >> > dennispaulson AT comcast.net >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > _______________________________________________ >> >> > Odonata-l mailing list >> >> > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >> >> > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Odonata-l mailing list >> >> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >> >> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Odonata-l mailing list >> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings From: Sherry McCowan <mccowan AT swbell.net> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 07:45:03 -0600 Just took a look at the Nat Geo rules, which include a link to the following "comments on image manipulation": "Please submit photographs that are un-manipulated and real, and that capture those special moments in time. The world is already full of visual artifice, and we don’t want the National Geographic Photography Contest to add to it. We want to see the world through your eyes, not the tools of Photoshop or setup photography." _____________________ Sherry McCowan Saint Louis, Missouri mccowan AT swbell.net On Jan 10, 2012, at 6:41 AM, Laudermilk, Ellis (EEC) wrote: > I spend a fair amount of time reading the opinions of professional > nature photographers and most of them only approve of "fake" photos > when the photographer clearly identifies that major elements of the > photo were manipulated or staged. I’m not talking about minor post- > processing of exposure, white balance, etc., since that is commonly > done. I’m talking about something more egregious. For example, > capturing a photo of an animal in captivity and then claiming the > photo was taken in the wild under natural conditions is unethical. > You may recall an example of a photographer being stripped of his > prize for that very reason. If not, read about it here with a photo > here. The rules of the competition will define what is acceptable. > I haven’t read the rules of Nat Geo competition, but I suspect they > were judging this photo based on the photographer’s description, > which as Marion points out states he captured what nature presented. > > Ellis Laudermilk > > Kentucky > > > -----Original Message----- > From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu > ] On Behalf Of Marion Dobbs > Sent: Monday, January 09, 2012 9:44 PM > To: Odonata List Server > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings > > While "nature-faking" may be acceptable in a given competition, > deliberate misrepresentation should not. The photographer clearly > states that sudden rain and beautiful lighting, combined with his > sudden awareness of a perfect photographable subject, produced this > serendipitous prize-winner. > > > Marion Dobbs > > 9 Bridlewood Lane > > Rome GA 30165 > > ecurlew AT mac.com > > http://www.mamomi.net > > http://mamomi.smugmug.com > > "All science is either physics or stamp collecting." _Ernest > Rutherford > > On Jan 9, 2012, at 7:24 PM, Dennis Paulson wrote: > > > Interestingly, Fred Lencioni just emailed me that he thought it > didn't matter, that what counted for this competition was the photo, > not how it was set up. As long as there was no post-processing > modifications, "nature faking" was all right. I don't know if that's > true or not, but it is something to be considered. > > > > > > His nature faking certainly set up quite a discussion based on its > being real. That also is something to think about. Can we use online > photos of dragonflies as data points for behavior, habitat, etc.,, > or do we need to exercise caution? > > > > > > Dennis > > > > > > > > > On Jan 9, 2012, at 3:48 PM, Mike Ferro wrote: > > > > > >> If you visit his website a lot of his photos seem to be staged > (or are > > >> at least incredibly improbable) and he has numerous photos of > insects > > >> covered in condensation. http://500px.com/shikhei > > >> > > >> There are four photos of rain on dragonflies: > > >> > > >> Same perch: > > >> http://500px.com/photo/3000362 > > >> http://500px.com/photo/3963219 > > >> > > >> Different perches: > > >> http://500px.com/photo/2129340 > > >> http://500px.com/photo/2457760 > > >> > > >> And one dragon without rain: > > >> http://500px.com/photo/1493103 > > >> > > >> The rain drops seem too fine to me. Can anyone find an example of a > > >> macro photo of rain that reproduces that effect? Additionally the > > >> angle of the spray (see http://500px.com/photo/2457760) is > consistent > > >> with Dennis's hypothesized spritzer. > > >> > > >> They are beautiful photos, but they shouldn't be passed off as > real if > > >> they are staged. > > >> > > >> Cheers, > > >> > > >> Mike > > >> > > >> > > >> On Mon, Jan 9, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Dennis Paulson > > >> wrote: > > >>> Again, from K. D. B. Dijkstra. > > >>> > > >>> Begin forwarded message: > > >>> > > >>> From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." > > >>> Date: January 9, 2012 2:05:02 PM PST > > >>> To: Dennis Paulson > > >>> Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] Fwd: dragonfly closes wings > > >>> > > >>> Hi Dennis, > > >>> > > >>> The photograper said this about his winner: > > >>> > > >>> "I wasn’t actually aware of this dragonfly since I was occupied > with other > > >>> objects. When I was about to take a picture of it, it suddenly > rained, but > > >>> the lighting was just superb. I decided to take the shot > regardless of the > > >>> rain. The result caused me to be overjoyed, and I hope it > pleases viewers." > > >>> > > >>> That doesn't agree with having three different individuals with > the same > > >>> superb light and sudden rain... > > >>> > > >>> Cheers, KD > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> _______________________________________________ > > >>> Odonata-l mailing list > > >>> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > >>> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > >>> > > >> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> Odonata-l mailing list > > >> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > >> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > > > > > ----- > > > Dennis Paulson > > > 1724 NE 98 St. > > > Seattle, WA 98115 > > > 206-528-1382 > > > dennispaulson AT comcast.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Odonata-l mailing list > > > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > > _______________________________________________ > > Odonata-l mailing list > > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Grant opportunities - Montana From: George Sims <georgesims AT hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 07:35:43 -0600 Andrea, Don't know of any grant opportunities; however, I had the pleasure of doing some casual collecting in Montana this past spring. Collected Argia translata in Big Horn County (Odonata Central #332459); however, the record was understandably not verified, since the animal would have been HUNDREDS of miles outside its normal range. Sure would be nice if some of your Montana colleagues could visit the site and substantiate it, although I understand at least one collector has tried, without success. George Sims Mansfield, Missouri > From: odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 95, Issue 7 > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 15:48:23 -0800 > > Send Odonata-l mailing list submissions to > odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu > > You can reach the person managing the list at > odonata-l-owner AT listhost.ups.edu > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Odonata-l digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Fwd: dragonfly closes wings (Dennis Paulson) > 2. grant opportunities for survey/monitoring? (Andrea Stephens) > 3. Fwd: dragonfly closes wings (Dennis Paulson) > 4. Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings (Dennis Paulson) > 5. Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings (Mike Ferro) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 13:44:57 -0800 > From: Dennis Paulson > Subject: [Odonata-l] Fwd: dragonfly closes wings > To: Odonata-l > Message-ID: <6C5CBC9C-4DB0-45F0-AD77-DB53EE21F671 AT comcast.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > Forwarded from K. D. B. Dijkstra: > > Begin forwarded message: > > > From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." > > Date: January 9, 2012 8:14:00 AM PST > > To: 'Dennis Paulson' , Odonata-l > > Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings > > > > Similar to the use of ?obelisk? position or behaviour for many libellulids with raised abdomen and dropped wings, I like to refer to this behaviour (in which the tip of an exposed perch is preferred, the wings are raised and often flutter in the wind, the legs are thrust forward and the abdomen is often either raised as well or held notably down) as ?pennant? position or behaviour. This is derived from several genera known as ?pennants? (most notably Selysiothemis in Eurasia) which like to ?play flag?. In Africa Rhyothemis, Tramea, Urothemis and some Trithemis species are most notable for ?pennanting?. > > > > Best wishes > > > > Klaas-Douwe 'KD' B. Dijkstra > > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity Naturalis > > PO Box 9517, 2300 RA Leiden, The Netherlands > > kd.dijkstra AT ncbnaturalis.nl > > http://science.naturalis.nl/dijkstra > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/kiskadee > > > > Int. J. Odonatology is now ISI listed! > > http://ecoevo.uvigo.es/IJO/home.html > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20120109/fe0cdc19/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 14:54:04 -0700 > From: Andrea Stephens > Subject: [Odonata-l] grant opportunities for survey/monitoring? > To: > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > I'm curious if anyone has leads on grant possibilities for the development > of an odonate survey and monitoring program - we're here in the > wetland-rich Swan Valley of Montana and hope to work with citizen > volunteers on gathering data to be housed with our state's Heritage > Program. Who out there might be interested in funding us for our initial > season of establishing several long-term monitoring stations, purchasing > basic equipment, and beginning the process of developing voucher > collections? > Thanks for any suggestions! > Andrea Stephens > Watershed Stewardship Specialist > Northwest Connections > www.northwestconnections.org > > andrea AT northwestconnections.org > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20120109/dc60492d/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 13:54:13 -0800 > From: Dennis Paulson > Subject: [Odonata-l] Fwd: dragonfly closes wings > To: Odonata-l > Message-ID: <5CF4643F-625C-4EFD-834C-C7049211A431 AT comcast.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > I will add to KD's message that I have now looked at the photos listed by David, and I suspect they are fakes, in the sense that the "rain drops" don't cover the entire photo in one of the photos of the female. This would seem to be an impossibility if it were actually raining, and I also wonder if the female wasn't hanging up rather than perched horizontally and was squirted with water ("spritzed") just as the photo was taken. Then the photo was rotated. > > Much as I hate to spoil anyone's fun, if this photo is bogus, then it should be exposed, as it was a prize winner in a major contest. If anyone has any contacts with National Geographic, it would be worthwhile to contact them with this concern. The photographer should be questioned, but by National Geographic, not by our community of odonatologists. > > Dennis > > ---------------------------- > Forwarded from K. D. B. Dijkstra: > > Begin forwarded message: > > > From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." > > Date: January 9, 2012 11:55:15 AM PST > > To: Dennis Paulson > > Cc: David Vilasis > > Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings > > > > Hi Dennis, > > > > My earlier message to the group didn't get through (maybe you have to okay it), so directly to you: I wonder if this "NG grand prize" may be tricked are at least 'assisted'. At least these are three different individuals (males, females, diff. perches) and the angle might have been turned (not a huge sin, but it explains the vertical rain, so these individuals were hanging... indeed at least one is quite teneral). Then the bright light and character of the drops doesn't make sense to me entirely. The female looks like she was dry until the splash in the picture arrived. How can you be so lucky? Maybe it was squirted on during a sunny day? > > > > I'm not sure, just a thought to explore... > > > > Cheers, KD > > > > ________________________________ > > From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] on behalf of David Vilasis [davidvilasis AT gmail.com] > > Sent: 09 January 2012 20:38 > > To: Dennis Paulson > > Cc: Odonata-l > > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings > > > > > > More images by the same author with the same idea. That if, with great vertical rain, a little rain andvery little rain lateral side, say the last picture is even more curious. > > > > http://500px.com/photo/2457760 > > > > http://500px.com/photo/3000362 > > > > http://500px.com/photo/2129340 > > > > David Vilas?s Boix. > > C/Bonaire 14 > > Seva-08553 > > davidvilasis AT gmail.com > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20120109/3ee9e22a/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 15:28:16 -0800 > From: Dennis Paulson > Subject: [Odonata-l] Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings > To: Odonata-l > Message-ID: <29C969F9-4F6D-40DF-92B0-7CC3E605BBA8 AT comcast.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > Again, from K. D. B. Dijkstra. > > Begin forwarded message: > > > From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." > > Date: January 9, 2012 2:05:02 PM PST > > To: Dennis Paulson > > Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] Fwd: dragonfly closes wings > > > > Hi Dennis, > > > > The photograper said this about his winner: > > > > "I wasn?t actually aware of this dragonfly since I was occupied with other objects. When I was about to take a picture of it, it suddenly rained, but the lighting was just superb. I decided to take the shot regardless of the rain. The result caused me to be overjoyed, and I hope it pleases viewers." > > > > That doesn't agree with having three different individuals with the same superb light and sudden rain... > > > > Cheers, KD > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20120109/03cf6d69/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 17:48:02 -0600 > From: Mike Ferro > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings > To: Odonata List Server > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > If you visit his website a lot of his photos seem to be staged (or are > at least incredibly improbable) and he has numerous photos of insects > covered in condensation. http://500px.com/shikhei > > There are four photos of rain on dragonflies: > > Same perch: > http://500px.com/photo/3000362 > http://500px.com/photo/3963219 > > Different perches: > http://500px.com/photo/2129340 > http://500px.com/photo/2457760 > > And one dragon without rain: > http://500px.com/photo/1493103 > > The rain drops seem too fine to me. Can anyone find an example of a > macro photo of rain that reproduces that effect? Additionally the > angle of the spray (see http://500px.com/photo/2457760) is consistent > with Dennis's hypothesized spritzer. > > They are beautiful photos, but they shouldn't be passed off as real if > they are staged. > > Cheers, > > Mike > > > On Mon, Jan 9, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Dennis Paulson > wrote: > > Again, from K. D. B. Dijkstra. > > > > Begin forwarded message: > > > > From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." > > Date: January 9, 2012 2:05:02 PM PST > > To: Dennis Paulson > > Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] Fwd: dragonfly closes wings > > > > Hi Dennis, > > > > The photograper said this about his winner: > > > > "I wasn?t actually aware of this dragonfly since I was occupied with other > > objects. When I was about to take a picture of it, it suddenly rained, but > > the lighting was just superb. I decided to take the shot regardless of the > > rain. The result caused me to be overjoyed, and I hope it pleases viewers." > > > > That doesn't agree with having three different individuals with the same > > superb light and sudden rain... > > > > Cheers, KD > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Odonata-l mailing list > > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > > End of Odonata-l Digest, Vol 95, Issue 7 > **************************************** _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings From: "Laudermilk, Ellis (EEC)" <Ellis.Laudermilk AT ky.gov> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 07:41:33 -0500 I spend a fair amount of time reading the opinions of professional nature photographers and most of them only approve of "fake" photos when the photographer clearly identifies that major elements of the photo were manipulated or staged. I'm not talking about minor post-processing of exposure, white balance, etc., since that is commonly done. I'm talking about something more egregious. For example, capturing a photo of an animal in captivity and then claiming the photo was taken in the wild under natural conditions is unethical. You may recall an example of a photographer being stripped of his prize for that very reason. If not, read about it here with a photo here . The rules of the competition will define what is acceptable. I haven't read the rules of Nat Geo competition, but I suspect they were judging this photo based on the photographer's description, which as Marion points out states he captured what nature presented. Ellis Laudermilk Kentucky -----Original Message----- From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Marion Dobbs Sent: Monday, January 09, 2012 9:44 PM To: Odonata List Server Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings While "nature-faking" may be acceptable in a given competition, deliberate misrepresentation should not. The photographer clearly states that sudden rain and beautiful lighting, combined with his sudden awareness of a perfect photographable subject, produced this serendipitous prize-winner. Marion Dobbs 9 Bridlewood Lane Rome GA 30165 ecurlew AT mac.com http://www.mamomi.net http://mamomi.smugmug.com "All science is either physics or stamp collecting." _Ernest Rutherford On Jan 9, 2012, at 7:24 PM, Dennis Paulson wrote: > Interestingly, Fred Lencioni just emailed me that he thought it didn't matter, that what counted for this competition was the photo, not how it was set up. As long as there was no post-processing modifications, "nature faking" was all right. I don't know if that's true or not, but it is something to be considered. > > His nature faking certainly set up quite a discussion based on its being real. That also is something to think about. Can we use online photos of dragonflies as data points for behavior, habitat, etc.,, or do we need to exercise caution? > > Dennis > > > On Jan 9, 2012, at 3:48 PM, Mike Ferro wrote: > >> If you visit his website a lot of his photos seem to be staged (or are >> at least incredibly improbable) and he has numerous photos of insects >> covered in condensation. http://500px.com/shikhei >> >> There are four photos of rain on dragonflies: >> >> Same perch: >> http://500px.com/photo/3000362 >> http://500px.com/photo/3963219 >> >> Different perches: >> http://500px.com/photo/2129340 >> http://500px.com/photo/2457760 >> >> And one dragon without rain: >> http://500px.com/photo/1493103 >> >> The rain drops seem too fine to me. Can anyone find an example of a >> macro photo of rain that reproduces that effect? Additionally the >> angle of the spray (see http://500px.com/photo/2457760) is consistent >> with Dennis's hypothesized spritzer. >> >> They are beautiful photos, but they shouldn't be passed off as real if >> they are staged. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Mike >> >> >> On Mon, Jan 9, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Dennis Paulson >> wrote: >>> Again, from K. D. B. Dijkstra. >>> >>> Begin forwarded message: >>> >>> From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." >>> Date: January 9, 2012 2:05:02 PM PST >>> To: Dennis Paulson >>> Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] Fwd: dragonfly closes wings >>> >>> Hi Dennis, >>> >>> The photograper said this about his winner: >>> >>> "I wasn't actually aware of this dragonfly since I was occupied with other >>> objects. When I was about to take a picture of it, it suddenly rained, but >>> the lighting was just superb. I decided to take the shot regardless of the >>> rain. The result caused me to be overjoyed, and I hope it pleases viewers." >>> >>> That doesn't agree with having three different individuals with the same >>> superb light and sudden rain... >>> >>> Cheers, KD >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Odonata-l mailing list >>> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >>> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Odonata-l mailing list >> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > ----- > Dennis Paulson > 1724 NE 98 St. > Seattle, WA 98115 > 206-528-1382 > dennispaulson AT comcast.net > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings From: "Rowe, Richard" <richard.rowe AT jcu.edu.au> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 23:45:49 -0800 exercise caution! plane of focus is interesting, the raindrops all seem to lie in the same narrow plane ... even the one (in the third, half-frame 'rain') that lies in front of the eye. The rain is interesting, but I have seen rain like that in previous Nat Geo photos. But how was it lit? The specimen seems rim lit (facing towards light source early/late in day) but plenty of fill. Rim lighting conditions would give the light-streak effect (except that one in front of the eye should usually be shaded ... ). The droplets have moved ~5mm, what is the terminal velocity of light rain? I'd guess 2m/s (it can be calculated but I don't have appropriate references with me) ... so exposure ~1/50s, but very sharp ... Great hand/monopod/tripod job (some people do have such steadiness of grip). Rim lighting with fill (reflector board?)? Anyway Nat Geo's photographers should be much more adept than we are at analysing this series of photographs, Richard Dr Richard Rowe Zoology & Tropical Ecology School of Marine & Tropical Biology James Cook University Townsville 4811 AUSTRALIA ph +61 7 47 81 4851 fax +61 7 47 25 1570 JCU has CRICOS Provider Code 00117J !!! my perpetual account at gmail.com is richard.rowe.dragonflies !!! ________________________________________ From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Dennis Paulson [dennispaulson AT comcast.net] Sent: Tuesday, 10 January 2012 10:24 To: Mike Ferro Cc: Odonata List Server Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings Interestingly, Fred Lencioni just emailed me that he thought it didn't matter, that what counted for this competition was the photo, not how it was set up. As long as there was no post-processing modifications, "nature faking" was all right. I don't know if that's true or not, but it is something to be considered. His nature faking certainly set up quite a discussion based on its being real. That also is something to think about. Can we use online photos of dragonflies as data points for behavior, habitat, etc.,, or do we need to exercise caution? Dennis On Jan 9, 2012, at 3:48 PM, Mike Ferro wrote: > If you visit his website a lot of his photos seem to be staged (or are > at least incredibly improbable) and he has numerous photos of insects > covered in condensation. http://500px.com/shikhei > > There are four photos of rain on dragonflies: > > Same perch: > http://500px.com/photo/3000362 > http://500px.com/photo/3963219 > > Different perches: > http://500px.com/photo/2129340 > http://500px.com/photo/2457760 > > And one dragon without rain: > http://500px.com/photo/1493103 > > The rain drops seem too fine to me. Can anyone find an example of a > macro photo of rain that reproduces that effect? Additionally the > angle of the spray (see http://500px.com/photo/2457760) is consistent > with Dennis's hypothesized spritzer. > > They are beautiful photos, but they shouldn't be passed off as real if > they are staged. > > Cheers, > > Mike > > > On Mon, Jan 9, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Dennis Paulson > wrote: >> Again, from K. D. B. Dijkstra. >> >> Begin forwarded message: >> >> From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." >> Date: January 9, 2012 2:05:02 PM PST >> To: Dennis Paulson >> Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] Fwd: dragonfly closes wings >> >> Hi Dennis, >> >> The photograper said this about his winner: >> >> "I wasn’t actually aware of this dragonfly since I was occupied with other >> objects. When I was about to take a picture of it, it suddenly rained, but >> the lighting was just superb. I decided to take the shot regardless of the >> rain. The result caused me to be overjoyed, and I hope it pleases viewers." >> >> That doesn't agree with having three different individuals with the same >> superb light and sudden rain... >> >> Cheers, KD >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Odonata-l mailing list >> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l >> > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings From: Marion Dobbs <spreadwing AT mac.com> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 21:43:55 -0500 While "nature-faking" may be acceptable in a given competition, deliberate misrepresentation should not. The photographer clearly states that sudden rain and beautiful lighting, combined with his sudden awareness of a perfect photographable subject, produced this serendipitous prize-winner. Marion Dobbs 9 Bridlewood Lane Rome GA 30165 ecurlew AT mac.com http://www.mamomi.net http://mamomi.smugmug.com "All science is either physics or stamp collecting." _Ernest Rutherford On Jan 9, 2012, at 7:24 PM, Dennis Paulson wrote: > Interestingly, Fred Lencioni just emailed me that he thought it didn't matter, that what counted for this competition was the photo, not how it was set up. As long as there was no post-processing modifications, "nature faking" was all right. I don't know if that's true or not, but it is something to be considered. > > His nature faking certainly set up quite a discussion based on its being real. That also is something to think about. Can we use online photos of dragonflies as data points for behavior, habitat, etc.,, or do we need to exercise caution? > > Dennis > > > On Jan 9, 2012, at 3:48 PM, Mike Ferro wrote: > >> If you visit his website a lot of his photos seem to be staged (or are >> at least incredibly improbable) and he has numerous photos of insects >> covered in condensation. http://500px.com/shikhei >> >> There are four photos of rain on dragonflies: >> >> Same perch: >> http://500px.com/photo/3000362 >> http://500px.com/photo/3963219 >> >> Different perches: >> http://500px.com/photo/2129340 >> http://500px.com/photo/2457760 >> >> And one dragon without rain: >> http://500px.com/photo/1493103 >> >> The rain drops seem too fine to me. Can anyone find an example of a >> macro photo of rain that reproduces that effect? Additionally the >> angle of the spray (see http://500px.com/photo/2457760) is consistent >> with Dennis's hypothesized spritzer. >> >> They are beautiful photos, but they shouldn't be passed off as real if >> they are staged. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Mike >> >> >> On Mon, Jan 9, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Dennis Paulson >> wrote: >>> Again, from K. D. B. Dijkstra. >>> >>> Begin forwarded message: >>> >>> From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." >>> Date: January 9, 2012 2:05:02 PM PST >>> To: Dennis Paulson >>> Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] Fwd: dragonfly closes wings >>> >>> Hi Dennis, >>> >>> The photograper said this about his winner: >>> >>> "I wasn’t actually aware of this dragonfly since I was occupied with other >>> objects. When I was about to take a picture of it, it suddenly rained, but >>> the lighting was just superb. I decided to take the shot regardless of the >>> rain. The result caused me to be overjoyed, and I hope it pleases viewers." >>> >>> That doesn't agree with having three different individuals with the same >>> superb light and sudden rain... >>> >>> Cheers, KD >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Odonata-l mailing list >>> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >>> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Odonata-l mailing list >> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > ----- > Dennis Paulson > 1724 NE 98 St. > Seattle, WA 98115 > 206-528-1382 > dennispaulson AT comcast.net > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 16:24:54 -0800 Interestingly, Fred Lencioni just emailed me that he thought it didn't matter, that what counted for this competition was the photo, not how it was set up. As long as there was no post-processing modifications, "nature faking" was all right. I don't know if that's true or not, but it is something to be considered. His nature faking certainly set up quite a discussion based on its being real. That also is something to think about. Can we use online photos of dragonflies as data points for behavior, habitat, etc.,, or do we need to exercise caution? Dennis On Jan 9, 2012, at 3:48 PM, Mike Ferro wrote: > If you visit his website a lot of his photos seem to be staged (or are > at least incredibly improbable) and he has numerous photos of insects > covered in condensation. http://500px.com/shikhei > > There are four photos of rain on dragonflies: > > Same perch: > http://500px.com/photo/3000362 > http://500px.com/photo/3963219 > > Different perches: > http://500px.com/photo/2129340 > http://500px.com/photo/2457760 > > And one dragon without rain: > http://500px.com/photo/1493103 > > The rain drops seem too fine to me. Can anyone find an example of a > macro photo of rain that reproduces that effect? Additionally the > angle of the spray (see http://500px.com/photo/2457760) is consistent > with Dennis's hypothesized spritzer. > > They are beautiful photos, but they shouldn't be passed off as real if > they are staged. > > Cheers, > > Mike > > > On Mon, Jan 9, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Dennis Paulson > wrote: >> Again, from K. D. B. Dijkstra. >> >> Begin forwarded message: >> >> From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." >> Date: January 9, 2012 2:05:02 PM PST >> To: Dennis Paulson >> Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] Fwd: dragonfly closes wings >> >> Hi Dennis, >> >> The photograper said this about his winner: >> >> "I wasn’t actually aware of this dragonfly since I was occupied with other >> objects. When I was about to take a picture of it, it suddenly rained, but >> the lighting was just superb. I decided to take the shot regardless of the >> rain. The result caused me to be overjoyed, and I hope it pleases viewers." >> >> That doesn't agree with having three different individuals with the same >> superb light and sudden rain... >> >> Cheers, KD >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Odonata-l mailing list >> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l >> > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings From: Mike Ferro <spongymesophyll AT gmail.com> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 17:48:02 -0600 If you visit his website a lot of his photos seem to be staged (or are at least incredibly improbable) and he has numerous photos of insects covered in condensation. http://500px.com/shikhei There are four photos of rain on dragonflies: Same perch: http://500px.com/photo/3000362 http://500px.com/photo/3963219 Different perches: http://500px.com/photo/2129340 http://500px.com/photo/2457760 And one dragon without rain: http://500px.com/photo/1493103 The rain drops seem too fine to me. Can anyone find an example of a macro photo of rain that reproduces that effect? Additionally the angle of the spray (see http://500px.com/photo/2457760) is consistent with Dennis's hypothesized spritzer. They are beautiful photos, but they shouldn't be passed off as real if they are staged. Cheers, Mike On Mon, Jan 9, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Dennis Paulson wrote: > Again, from K. D. B. Dijkstra. > > Begin forwarded message: > > From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." > Date: January 9, 2012 2:05:02 PM PST > To: Dennis Paulson > Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] Fwd: dragonfly closes wings > > Hi Dennis, > > The photograper said this about his winner: > > "I wasn’t actually aware of this dragonfly since I was occupied with other > objects. When I was about to take a picture of it, it suddenly rained, but > the lighting was just superb. I decided to take the shot regardless of the > rain. The result caused me to be overjoyed, and I hope it pleases viewers." > > That doesn't agree with having three different individuals with the same > superb light and sudden rain... > > Cheers, KD > > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Fwd: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 15:28:16 -0800 Again, from K. D. B. Dijkstra. Begin forwarded message: > From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." > Date: January 9, 2012 2:05:02 PM PST > To: Dennis Paulson > Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] Fwd: dragonfly closes wings > > Hi Dennis, > > The photograper said this about his winner: > > "I wasn’t actually aware of this dragonfly since I was occupied with other objects. When I was about to take a picture of it, it suddenly rained, but the lighting was just superb. I decided to take the shot regardless of the rain. The result caused me to be overjoyed, and I hope it pleases viewers." > > That doesn't agree with having three different individuals with the same superb light and sudden rain... > > Cheers, KD_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 13:54:13 -0800 I will add to KD's message that I have now looked at the photos listed by David, and I suspect they are fakes, in the sense that the "rain drops" don't cover the entire photo in one of the photos of the female. This would seem to be an impossibility if it were actually raining, and I also wonder if the female wasn't hanging up rather than perched horizontally and was squirted with water ("spritzed") just as the photo was taken. Then the photo was rotated. Much as I hate to spoil anyone's fun, if this photo is bogus, then it should be exposed, as it was a prize winner in a major contest. If anyone has any contacts with National Geographic, it would be worthwhile to contact them with this concern. The photographer should be questioned, but by National Geographic, not by our community of odonatologists. Dennis ---------------------------- Forwarded from K. D. B. Dijkstra: Begin forwarded message: > From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." > Date: January 9, 2012 11:55:15 AM PST > To: Dennis Paulson > Cc: David Vilasis > Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings > > Hi Dennis, > > My earlier message to the group didn't get through (maybe you have to okay it), so directly to you: I wonder if this "NG grand prize" may be tricked are at least 'assisted'. At least these are three different individuals (males, females, diff. perches) and the angle might have been turned (not a huge sin, but it explains the vertical rain, so these individuals were hanging... indeed at least one is quite teneral). Then the bright light and character of the drops doesn't make sense to me entirely. The female looks like she was dry until the splash in the picture arrived. How can you be so lucky? Maybe it was squirted on during a sunny day? > > I'm not sure, just a thought to explore... > > Cheers, KD > > ________________________________ > From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] on behalf of David Vilasis [davidvilasis AT gmail.com] > Sent: 09 January 2012 20:38 > To: Dennis Paulson > Cc: Odonata-l > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings > > > More images by the same author with the same idea. That if, with great vertical rain, a little rain andvery little rain lateral side, say the last picture is even more curious. > > http://500px.com/photo/2457760 > > http://500px.com/photo/3000362 > > http://500px.com/photo/2129340 > > David Vilasís Boix. > C/Bonaire 14 > Seva-08553 > davidvilasis AT gmail.com _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: grant opportunities for survey/monitoring? From: Andrea Stephens <agstephens114 AT gmail.com> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 14:54:04 -0700 I'm curious if anyone has leads on grant possibilities for the development of an odonate survey and monitoring program - we're here in the wetland-rich Swan Valley of Montana and hope to work with citizen volunteers on gathering data to be housed with our state's Heritage Program. Who out there might be interested in funding us for our initial season of establishing several long-term monitoring stations, purchasing basic equipment, and beginning the process of developing voucher collections? Thanks for any suggestions! Andrea Stephens Watershed Stewardship Specialist Northwest Connections www.northwestconnections.org andrea AT northwestconnections.org_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Fwd: dragonfly closes wings From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 13:44:57 -0800 Forwarded from K. D. B. Dijkstra: Begin forwarded message: > From: "Dijkstra, K.D.B." > Date: January 9, 2012 8:14:00 AM PST > To: 'Dennis Paulson' , Odonata-l > Subject: RE: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings > > Similar to the use of “obelisk” position or behaviour for many libellulids with raised abdomen and dropped wings, I like to refer to this behaviour (in which the tip of an exposed perch is preferred, the wings are raised and often flutter in the wind, the legs are thrust forward and the abdomen is often either raised as well or held notably down) as “pennant” position or behaviour. This is derived from several genera known as “pennants” (most notably Selysiothemis in Eurasia) which like to “play flag”. In Africa Rhyothemis, Tramea, Urothemis and some Trithemis species are most notable for “pennanting”. > > Best wishes > > Klaas-Douwe 'KD' B. Dijkstra > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity Naturalis > PO Box 9517, 2300 RA Leiden, The Netherlands > kd.dijkstra AT ncbnaturalis.nl > http://science.naturalis.nl/dijkstra > http://www.flickr.com/photos/kiskadee > > Int. J. Odonatology is now ISI listed! > http://ecoevo.uvigo.es/IJO/home.html _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: dragonfly closes wings From: David Vilasis <davidvilasis AT gmail.com> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 20:38:22 +0100 More images by the same author with the same idea. That if, with great vertical rain, a little rain andvery little rain lateral side, say the last picture is even more curious. http://500px.com/photo/2457760 http://500px.com/photo/3000362 http://500px.com/photo/2129340 David Vilasís Boix. C/Bonaire 14 Seva-08553 davidvilasis AT gmail.com http://calaixdimatges.blogspot.com/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/40391552 AT N04/sets/ http://www.oxygastra.org/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=281 El 09/01/2012, a las 16:41, Dennis Paulson escribió: > David, > > I think you're right, that very young individuals are much more likely to close their wings again, perhaps only under certain conditions. Probably Mike Ferro's T. pallidinervis from Thailand was one such. > > But I conclude from all the additional posts that wing-closing in mature individuals is indeed very unusual in Anisoptera, but many species perch with the wings elevated, especially those that perch in the open in areas that can be windy. T. pallidinervis seems to be an extreme case of wing elevation when normally perched. > > Thanks for all the responses, and it's great that all those photos are posted online where they can be used as reference "specimens." > > Dennis > > > On Jan 9, 2012, at 12:59 AM, David Kitching wrote: > >> On 9 Jan 2012 at 6:15, Colin Adams wrote: >> >>> I seem to recall a few observations of Cordulegaster boltonii folding its >>> wings during rain, mentioned in the BDS's Dragonfly New magazine. >> >> I have seen Gomphus vulgatissimus fold its wings during heavy rain - we tend >> to get plenty of that in the average British summer. There are two images of >> separate insects demonstrating this at: >> >> http://www.brocross.com/temp/gomphus/gomphus.htm >> >> Both insects illustrated are teneral but some hours after the maiden flight. I >> observed one of them closing its wings as the rain increased. I wonder whether >> this behaviour is more common with teneral insects than with fully mature >> specimens? >> >> >> -- >> David Kitching >> http://www.brocross.com >> fearrmeox adlaþ brægen >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Odonata-l mailing list >> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > ----- > Dennis Paulson > 1724 NE 98 St. > Seattle, WA 98115 > 206-528-1382 > dennispaulson AT comcast.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: dragonfly closes wings From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 07:41:44 -0800 David, I think you're right, that very young individuals are much more likely to close their wings again, perhaps only under certain conditions. Probably Mike Ferro's T. pallidinervis from Thailand was one such. But I conclude from all the additional posts that wing-closing in mature individuals is indeed very unusual in Anisoptera, but many species perch with the wings elevated, especially those that perch in the open in areas that can be windy. T. pallidinervis seems to be an extreme case of wing elevation when normally perched. Thanks for all the responses, and it's great that all those photos are posted online where they can be used as reference "specimens." Dennis On Jan 9, 2012, at 12:59 AM, David Kitching wrote: > On 9 Jan 2012 at 6:15, Colin Adams wrote: > >> I seem to recall a few observations of Cordulegaster boltonii folding its >> wings during rain, mentioned in the BDS's Dragonfly New magazine. > > I have seen Gomphus vulgatissimus fold its wings during heavy rain - we tend > to get plenty of that in the average British summer. There are two images of > separate insects demonstrating this at: > > http://www.brocross.com/temp/gomphus/gomphus.htm > > Both insects illustrated are teneral but some hours after the maiden flight. I > observed one of them closing its wings as the rain increased. I wonder whether > this behaviour is more common with teneral insects than with fully mature > specimens? > > > -- > David Kitching > http://www.brocross.com > fearrmeox adlaþ brægen > > > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: dragonfly closes wings From: Keith Wilson <kdpwilson AT gmail.com> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 09:21:46 +0400 The *Trithemis pallidinervis* photographed is balanced on the end of a grass stem facing the wind. The wings are not closed, but 'V'-shaped and this is typical for this species when facing a strong breeze. It probably helps reduce the wind pressure over its wing area. It does this whether its raining or not. Many *Rhyothemis *spp. do the same when perched on grass stems in breezy conditions. On 9 January 2012 02:06, Dennis Paulson wrote: > There are statements in the literature such as "once a dragonfly opens its > wings, it never closes them again." There are a few genera of anisopterans ( > *Cordulephya*, *Zenithoptera*) that routinely perch with closed wings, > but otherwise you don't see such a thing. I have seen a number of > dragonflies asleep at night, and their wings were open. > > So this winning photo in a National Geographic photo contest is quite > interesting: > > > http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2012/01/national_geographic_photograph.html > > Unless the photographer had some way to fake it, which doesn't seem > likely, this dragonfly (*Trithemis pallidinervis*) has closed its wings > when it started to rain rather than flying away. This makes sense, but I > didn't know it occurred. Has anyone else seen anything like this? Most > dragonfly watchers aren't out in the rain! > > ----- > Dennis Paulson > 1724 NE 98 St. > Seattle, WA 98115 > 206-528-1382 > dennispaulson AT comcast.net > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > >_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: dragonfly closes wings From: rhainer guillermo <rhainerguillermo AT yahoo.com.br> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 04:57:28 -0800 Here are photos of what I've mentioned before. A male Erythrodiplax media, holding wings up, right after cooling, and down, some minutes later. http://www.flickr.com/photos/67285320 AT N05/6666556071/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/67285320 AT N05/6666558123/ --- Em seg, 9/1/12, Tang Hung Bun escreveu: De: Tang Hung Bun Assunto: Re: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings Para: "Dennis Paulson" , "Jim Johnson" Cc: "Odonata-l" Data: Segunda-feira, 9 de Janeiro de 2012, 0:26 The photo did not look odd to me when I first saw it two weeks ago. I looked through my photos of T. pallidinervis that I took in these few years and yes this species sometimes holds its wings so high that it looks as if the wings are closed. Dennis, you are right that T. pallidinervis perches out in more exposed (and therefore more windy) areas. I think that's why they need to hold their wings up in order to stay on their perch. How high up the wings are held depends on how strong the wind is. Please have a look at the my photos on this page. Cheers,TangSingapore From: Dennis Paulson To: Jim Johnson Cc: Odonata-l Sent: Monday, 9 January 2012, 8:21 Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings All of the respondents make very good points. I was hoping someone would chime in and give an example where they actually saw anisopterans closing their wings, but so far nothing like that. These wings are certainly more elevated than is usually the case with dragonflies, but indeed it's possible that they were beating at the time. This would have had to be fairly slow, as the shutter speed must have been slow enough for the rain drops to streak, and I would have expected blurring if they were beating rapidly. There is some blurring in the wings, and I figured it was caused just by the wind moving them. And indeed they are not closed all the way, as you can see the stigmas of the far wings. Jim, I looked at the web pages you listed and see what you mean. Then I checked out my own photos of T. pallidinervis and found one from Nepal that had the wings almost closed, perhaps a little more than the National Geographic one. I hadn't recalled that, as it was many years ago. So perhaps this is a species that often perches like this, even when it's not raining! Libellulid genera that normally hold their wings elevated are a real contrast with the many genera that hold them depressed when at rest, and others that seem to hold them level most of the time. In my experience, they are wind-perchers (American genera include Brachymesia, Celithemis, Idiataphe and Macrodiplax). I have always thought that holding the wings up in the wind should give them some stability, just like the dihedral angle of the wings of low-flying raptors. There is a fascinating contrast between Brachymesia gravida and Brachymesia furcata. The former perches in very exposed situations, usually with the wings elevated, and the latter - even though at some of the same water bodies - typically perches lower and more out of the wind. It perches with the wings level or depressed most of the time. B. herbida, which occurs widely with B. furcata, is more like B. gravida. I think T. pallidinervis perches out in more exposed areas than many other Trithemis, and the majority of species of that genus that I have seen typically perch with wings depressed. This sort of discussion of comparative natural history is why I initiated Odonata-l many years ago. Nowadays, with so many people watching odonates, we can communicate about them worldwide and learn many things that weren't known, for example, when Philip Corbet was writing his big book. Dennis On Jan 8, 2012, at 2:38 PM, Jim Johnson wrote: Hi Dennis,  The rain streaks in that photo are almost sideways, so it must have been pretty windy at that moment too. I would assume that that was a significant factor in this case. This individual appears to be a very fresh adult and maybe that’s a factor too.  I’m not familiar with this species so I just did a quick Internet search for photos. It seems that individuals of this species frequently perch with the wings held at an upward angle. Here are a couple of sites which came up near the top of the search results:  http://odonata-malaysia.blogspot.com/2010/06/trithemis-pallidinervis.htmlhttp://mandysmlee.multiply.com/photos/album/98/Libellulidae_-_Trithemis_pallidinervis  The second one has a photo of one with the wings closed even more so than the National Geographic example. I imagine that the combination of behavior and wind (and perhaps immaturity) explain why the wings are up so high.  Cheers,  Jim JohnsonVancouver, Washingtonhttp://odonata.bogfoot.net/http://nwdragonflier.blogspot.com/    From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Dennis Paulson Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2012 2:07 PM To: Odonata-l Subject: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings  There are statements in the literature such as "once a dragonfly opens its wings, it never closes them again." There are a few genera of anisopterans (Cordulephya, Zenithoptera) that routinely perch with closed wings, but otherwise you don't see such a thing. I have seen a number of dragonflies asleep at night, and their wings were open.  So this winning photo in a National Geographic photo contest is quite interesting:  http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2012/01/national_geographic_photograph.html  Unless the photographer had some way to fake it, which doesn't seem likely, this dragonfly (Trithemis pallidinervis) has closed its wings when it started to rain rather than flying away. This makes sense, but I didn't know it occurred. Has anyone else seen anything like this? Most dragonfly watchers aren't out in the rain!  -----Dennis Paulson1724 NE 98 St.Seattle, WA 98115206-528-1382dennispaulson AT comcast.net     _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l -----Dennis Paulson1724 NE 98 St.Seattle, WA 98115206-528-1382dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l -----Anexo incorporado----- _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: dragonfly closes wings From: David Kitching <davidk AT brocross.co.uk> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 08:59:33 +0000 On 9 Jan 2012 at 6:15, Colin Adams wrote: > I seem to recall a few observations of Cordulegaster boltonii folding its > wings during rain, mentioned in the BDS's Dragonfly New magazine. I have seen Gomphus vulgatissimus fold its wings during heavy rain - we tend to get plenty of that in the average British summer. There are two images of separate insects demonstrating this at: http://www.brocross.com/temp/gomphus/gomphus.htm Both insects illustrated are teneral but some hours after the maiden flight. I observed one of them closing its wings as the rain increased. I wonder whether this behaviour is more common with teneral insects than with fully mature specimens? -- David Kitching http://www.brocross.com fearrmeox adlaþ brægen _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: dragonfly closes wings From: Mike Ferro <spongymesophyll AT gmail.com> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 00:36:25 -0600 I'll add to the mix. I took these photos in Chiang Mai, Thailand in 2003. The first two with the wings together were taken about 30 minutes before the second two with the wings apart. It appeared to be a very young adult. The individual was on the second story of a lab building. https://picasaweb.google.com/108279953306115325580/ThaiDragon Cheers, Mike On Mon, Jan 9, 2012 at 12:15 AM, Colin Adams wrote: > I seem to recall a few observations of Cordulegaster boltonii folding its > wings during rain, mentioned in the BDS's Dragonfly New magazine. > > Also, last year (first time I've had the opportunity to say that in 2012!) I > saw a Leucorrhinia dubia teneral on its maiden flight. It settled on sapling > with wings open in the usual way. I turned away to gather my camera, but > when i looked back it had folded its wings: > > http://colina.demon.co.uk/?q=node/1538 > > Looking at the competition photo, my first thought was that it might just be > perspective. Pallidinervis often has its wings held high. I've not seen it > in the rain, though. > > On 8 January 2012 22:06, Dennis Paulson wrote: >> >> There are statements in the literature such as "once a dragonfly opens its >> wings, it never closes them again." There are a few genera of anisopterans >> (Cordulephya, Zenithoptera) that routinely perch with closed wings, but >> otherwise you don't see such a thing. I have seen a number of dragonflies >> asleep at night, and their wings were open. >> >> So this winning photo in a National Geographic photo contest is quite >> interesting: >> >> >> http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2012/01/national_geographic_photograph.html >> >> Unless the photographer had some way to fake it, which doesn't seem >> likely, this dragonfly (Trithemis pallidinervis) has closed its wings when >> it started to rain rather than flying away. This makes sense, but I didn't >> know it occurred. Has anyone else seen anything like this? Most dragonfly >> watchers aren't out in the rain! >> >> ----- >> Dennis Paulson >> 1724 NE 98 St. >> Seattle, WA 98115 >> 206-528-1382 >> dennispaulson AT comcast.net >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Odonata-l mailing list >> Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >> https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: dragonfly closes wings From: Colin Adams <colinpauladams AT gmail.com> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 06:15:05 +0000 I seem to recall a few observations of Cordulegaster boltonii folding its wings during rain, mentioned in the BDS's Dragonfly New magazine. Also, last year (first time I've had the opportunity to say that in 2012!) I saw a Leucorrhinia dubia teneral on its maiden flight. It settled on sapling with wings open in the usual way. I turned away to gather my camera, but when i looked back it had folded its wings: http://colina.demon.co.uk/?q=node/1538 Looking at the competition photo, my first thought was that it might just be perspective. Pallidinervis often has its wings held high. I've not seen it in the rain, though. On 8 January 2012 22:06, Dennis Paulson wrote: > There are statements in the literature such as "once a dragonfly opens its > wings, it never closes them again." There are a few genera of anisopterans ( > *Cordulephya*, *Zenithoptera*) that routinely perch with closed wings, > but otherwise you don't see such a thing. I have seen a number of > dragonflies asleep at night, and their wings were open. > > So this winning photo in a National Geographic photo contest is quite > interesting: > > > http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2012/01/national_geographic_photograph.html > > Unless the photographer had some way to fake it, which doesn't seem > likely, this dragonfly (*Trithemis pallidinervis*) has closed its wings > when it started to rain rather than flying away. This makes sense, but I > didn't know it occurred. Has anyone else seen anything like this? Most > dragonfly watchers aren't out in the rain! > > ----- > Dennis Paulson > 1724 NE 98 St. > Seattle, WA 98115 > 206-528-1382 > dennispaulson AT comcast.net > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > >_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: dragonfly closes wings From: Tang Hung Bun <tanghungbun AT yahoo.com> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 10:26:27 +0800 The photo did not look odd to me when I first saw it two weeks ago. I looked through my photos of T. pallidinervis that I took in these few years and yes this species sometimes holds its wings so high that it looks as if the wings are closed. Dennis, you are right that T. pallidinervis perches out in more exposed (and therefore more windy) areas. I think that's why they need to hold their wings up in order to stay on their perch. How high up the wings are held depends on how strong the wind is. Please have a look at the my photos on this page. Cheers, Tang Singapore ________________________________ From: Dennis Paulson To: Jim Johnson Cc: Odonata-l Sent: Monday, 9 January 2012, 8:21 Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings All of the respondents make very good points. I was hoping someone would chime in and give an example where they actually saw anisopterans closing their wings, but so far nothing like that. These wings are certainly more elevated than is usually the case with dragonflies, but indeed it's possible that they were beating at the time. This would have had to be fairly slow, as the shutter speed must have been slow enough for the rain drops to streak, and I would have expected blurring if they were beating rapidly. There is some blurring in the wings, and I figured it was caused just by the wind moving them. And indeed they are not closed all the way, as you can see the stigmas of the far wings. Jim, I looked at the web pages you listed and see what you mean. Then I checked out my own photos of T. pallidinervis and found one from Nepal that had the wings almost closed, perhaps a little more than the National Geographic one. I hadn't recalled that, as it was many years ago. So perhaps this is a species that often perches like this, even when it's not raining! Libellulid genera that normally hold their wings elevated are a real contrast with the many genera that hold them depressed when at rest, and others that seem to hold them level most of the time. In my experience, they are wind-perchers (American genera include Brachymesia, Celithemis, Idiataphe and Macrodiplax). I have always thought that holding the wings up in the wind should give them some stability, just like the dihedral angle of the wings of low-flying raptors. There is a fascinating contrast between Brachymesia gravida and Brachymesia furcata. The former perches in very exposed situations, usually with the wings elevated, and the latter - even though at some of the same water bodies - typically perches lower and more out of the wind. It perches with the wings level or depressed most of the time. B. herbida, which occurs widely with B. furcata, is more like B. gravida. I think T. pallidinervis perches out in more exposed areas than many other Trithemis, and the majority of species of that genus that I have seen typically perch with wings depressed. This sort of discussion of comparative natural history is why I initiated Odonata-l many years ago. Nowadays, with so many people watching odonates, we can communicate about them worldwide and learn many things that weren't known, for example, when Philip Corbet was writing his big book. Dennis On Jan 8, 2012, at 2:38 PM, Jim Johnson wrote: Hi Dennis, >  >The rain streaks in that photo are almost sideways, so it must have been pretty windy at that moment too. I would assume that that was a significant factor in this case. This individual appears to be a very fresh adult and maybe that’s a factor too. >  >I’m not familiar with this species so I just did a quick Internet search for photos. It seems that individuals of this species frequently perch with the wings held at an upward angle. Here are a couple of sites which came up near the top of the search results: >  >http://odonata-malaysia.blogspot.com/2010/06/trithemis-pallidinervis.html >http://mandysmlee.multiply.com/photos/album/98/Libellulidae_-_Trithemis_pallidinervis >  >The second one has a photo of one with the wings closed even more so than the National Geographic example. I imagine that the combination of behavior and wind (and perhaps immaturity) explain why the wings are up so high. >  >Cheers, >  >Jim Johnson >Vancouver, Washington >http://odonata.bogfoot.net/ >http://nwdragonflier.blogspot.com/ >  >  >From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Dennis Paulson >Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2012 2:07 PM >To: Odonata-l >Subject: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings >  >There are statements in the literature such as "once a dragonfly opens its wings, it never closes them again." There are a few genera of anisopterans (Cordulephya, Zenithoptera) that routinely perch with closed wings, but otherwise you don't see such a thing. I have seen a number of dragonflies asleep at night, and their wings were open. >  >So this winning photo in a National Geographic photo contest is quite interesting: >  >http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2012/01/national_geographic_photograph.html >  >Unless the photographer had some way to fake it, which doesn't seem likely, this dragonfly (Trithemis pallidinervis) has closed its wings when it started to rain rather than flying away. This makes sense, but I didn't know it occurred. Has anyone else seen anything like this? Most dragonfly watchers aren't out in the rain! >  >----- >Dennis Paulson >1724 NE 98 St. >Seattle, WA 98115 >206-528-1382 >dennispaulson AT comcast.net >  > > > >  _______________________________________________ >Odonata-l mailing list >Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: A Chilean damselfly quandary From: rhainer guillermo <rhainerguillermo AT yahoo.com.br> Date: Sun, 8 Jan 2012 17:35:54 -0800 Hi Eric No doubt. It is a Cyanallagma, probably C. interruptum. Best wishes, Rhainer --- Em dom, 8/1/12, Eric LoPresti escreveu: De: Eric LoPresti Assunto: [Odonata-l] A Chilean damselfly quandary Para: Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Data: Domingo, 8 de Janeiro de 2012, 15:33 Howdy, Having been transplanted (temporarily) from Mass to Chiloe Island, Chile, (northern patagonia) I have been catching/photographing odes here since October (see: here & here) .    I have been able to get most identified (6 to species, 1 to genus and then the one detailed below). The region is really hurting in species numbers (birds and butterflies, too), but the species that are here are pretty common.  In the beginning of December, I found a female damsel that I immediately assumed was an Ischnura - having experience with the genus back in the states. There are two known from Chile – I. fluviatilis and ramburii, so I thought nothing more of the sighting and just figured I could deduce the species when I found a male - though I searched unsuccessfully for it again until the 6th of January, when I found a bunch of Ischnura-esque males near a little roadside pond.  However, I was immediately struck by the fact that the original female had an interrupted antehumeral stripe (like I. posita at home), but these males had only a partial antehumeral stripe - it was not interrupted, just incomplete.  The pictures are here (http://www.flickr.com/photos/26099887 AT N03/6660574589/in/photostream) stitched into one big pic. So I turned to the key (Heckman: Encyclopedia of South American Aquatic Insects) and got to this step:   “The antehumeral stripes of the males are blue and always interrupted, with the shorter segment on the posterior part of the synthorax. The superior anal appendage of the male has a prominent apical tooth (Fig. 3.1.364). .......................................................................Cyanallagma Kennedy, 1920..p. 533 - The antehumeral stripes of the male are not blue, or, if they are, they are not interrupted (Fig. 3.1.335). ...................................................................................32â€�   The female therefore, cannot be treated here, but the males can, and the antehumeral stripe would indicate moving on in the key (the photos do not show it well, but it seems no apical tooth is present - I would go out and check, but it is raining like hell). So when I move on to the next step it keys out as Ischnura. OK – I am sort of fine with this (as the stripe is blue and not interrupted).   The two species known from Chile fluviatilis and ramburii are a bit odd fits though. Because both have huge ranges, there are hundreds of photographs for each species online – showing complete antehumeral stripes. If I use the key, the males sort-of key out to fluviatilis (the anal appendages are broadly rounded, but don’t match the diagram all that well).   All in all, the males seem to key out to I. fluviatilis, but on the basis of the internet, I am not convinced. If I were wrong on the genus and key them through Cyanallagma, I get to this step:   “3. The third though seventh abdominal segments are blue with a black dorsal fringe on the anterior margin and along the midline (Fig. 3.1.633). ....................4 - The sixth abdominal segment is mainly black dorsally. The lateral membrane of the first penis segment has no more than a few short setae (Fig. 3.1.634). .....5â€� Which certainly fits option 2 – and thus bypasses C. interruptum, the only Chilean member of the genus (which doesn’t fit even if I move the other way). There is no female key to this genus – so perhaps the female could be this. I am by no means an expert (it is just an fun project - I am studying birds down here) and I'm that someone here has experience with the species/genera involved and can shed some light on this. If anyone has interest in Chilean odes, I have lots of pictures/observations that I would love to get to someone that can use them. Thanks, Eric LoPresti -----Anexo incorporado----- _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: dragonfly closes wings From: rhainer guillermo <rhainerguillermo AT yahoo.com.br> Date: Sun, 8 Jan 2012 17:32:57 -0800 Hi everyone I usually get this effect when I take pictures. I capture them, grab them by their wings (what obviously close them) and put them in a cooler for some while. After that, I put them on a perch of choice. While they warm up, I can take the pictures I want. They remain still, and some of them keep their wings almost closed, before they get warm and start beating wings. I'm not saying that T. pallidinervis do not close wings, but sometimes it can be a result of wings manipulation during photo sessions. Naturally, I've only seen Zenithoptera closing wings. Cheers Rhainer --- Em dom, 8/1/12, Dennis Paulson escreveu: De: Dennis Paulson Assunto: Re: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings Para: "Jim Johnson" Cc: "Odonata-l" Data: Domingo, 8 de Janeiro de 2012, 22:21 All of the respondents make very good points. I was hoping someone would chime in and give an example where they actually saw anisopterans closing their wings, but so far nothing like that. These wings are certainly more elevated than is usually the case with dragonflies, but indeed it's possible that they were beating at the time. This would have had to be fairly slow, as the shutter speed must have been slow enough for the rain drops to streak, and I would have expected blurring if they were beating rapidly. There is some blurring in the wings, and I figured it was caused just by the wind moving them. And indeed they are not closed all the way, as you can see the stigmas of the far wings. Jim, I looked at the web pages you listed and see what you mean. Then I checked out my own photos of T. pallidinervis and found one from Nepal that had the wings almost closed, perhaps a little more than the National Geographic one. I hadn't recalled that, as it was many years ago. So perhaps this is a species that often perches like this, even when it's not raining! Libellulid genera that normally hold their wings elevated are a real contrast with the many genera that hold them depressed when at rest, and others that seem to hold them level most of the time. In my experience, they are wind-perchers (American genera include Brachymesia, Celithemis, Idiataphe and Macrodiplax). I have always thought that holding the wings up in the wind should give them some stability, just like the dihedral angle of the wings of low-flying raptors. There is a fascinating contrast between Brachymesia gravida and Brachymesia furcata. The former perches in very exposed situations, usually with the wings elevated, and the latter - even though at some of the same water bodies - typically perches lower and more out of the wind. It perches with the wings level or depressed most of the time. B. herbida, which occurs widely with B. furcata, is more like B. gravida. I think T. pallidinervis perches out in more exposed areas than many other Trithemis, and the majority of species of that genus that I have seen typically perch with wings depressed. This sort of discussion of comparative natural history is why I initiated Odonata-l many years ago. Nowadays, with so many people watching odonates, we can communicate about them worldwide and learn many things that weren't known, for example, when Philip Corbet was writing his big book. Dennis On Jan 8, 2012, at 2:38 PM, Jim Johnson wrote: Hi Dennis,  The rain streaks in that photo are almost sideways, so it must have been pretty windy at that moment too. I would assume that that was a significant factor in this case. This individual appears to be a very fresh adult and maybe that’s a factor too.  I’m not familiar with this species so I just did a quick Internet search for photos. It seems that individuals of this species frequently perch with the wings held at an upward angle. Here are a couple of sites which came up near the top of the search results:  http://odonata-malaysia.blogspot.com/2010/06/trithemis-pallidinervis.htmlhttp://mandysmlee.multiply.com/photos/album/98/Libellulidae_-_Trithemis_pallidinervis  The second one has a photo of one with the wings closed even more so than the National Geographic example. I imagine that the combination of behavior and wind (and perhaps immaturity) explain why the wings are up so high.  Cheers,  Jim JohnsonVancouver, Washingtonhttp://odonata.bogfoot.net/http://nwdragonflier.blogspot.com/    From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Dennis Paulson Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2012 2:07 PM To: Odonata-l Subject: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings  There are statements in the literature such as "once a dragonfly opens its wings, it never closes them again." There are a few genera of anisopterans (Cordulephya, Zenithoptera) that routinely perch with closed wings, but otherwise you don't see such a thing. I have seen a number of dragonflies asleep at night, and their wings were open.  So this winning photo in a National Geographic photo contest is quite interesting:  http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2012/01/national_geographic_photograph.html  Unless the photographer had some way to fake it, which doesn't seem likely, this dragonfly (Trithemis pallidinervis) has closed its wings when it started to rain rather than flying away. This makes sense, but I didn't know it occurred. Has anyone else seen anything like this? Most dragonfly watchers aren't out in the rain!  -----Dennis Paulson1724 NE 98 St.Seattle, WA 98115206-528-1382dennispaulson AT comcast.net     _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l -----Dennis Paulson1724 NE 98 St.Seattle, WA 98115206-528-1382dennispaulson AT comcast.net -----Anexo incorporado----- _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: dragonfly closes wings From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Sun, 8 Jan 2012 16:21:07 -0800 All of the respondents make very good points. I was hoping someone would chime in and give an example where they actually saw anisopterans closing their wings, but so far nothing like that. These wings are certainly more elevated than is usually the case with dragonflies, but indeed it's possible that they were beating at the time. This would have had to be fairly slow, as the shutter speed must have been slow enough for the rain drops to streak, and I would have expected blurring if they were beating rapidly. There is some blurring in the wings, and I figured it was caused just by the wind moving them. And indeed they are not closed all the way, as you can see the stigmas of the far wings. Jim, I looked at the web pages you listed and see what you mean. Then I checked out my own photos of T. pallidinervis and found one from Nepal that had the wings almost closed, perhaps a little more than the National Geographic one. I hadn't recalled that, as it was many years ago. So perhaps this is a species that often perches like this, even when it's not raining! Libellulid genera that normally hold their wings elevated are a real contrast with the many genera that hold them depressed when at rest, and others that seem to hold them level most of the time. In my experience, they are wind-perchers (American genera include Brachymesia, Celithemis, Idiataphe and Macrodiplax). I have always thought that holding the wings up in the wind should give them some stability, just like the dihedral angle of the wings of low-flying raptors. There is a fascinating contrast between Brachymesia gravida and Brachymesia furcata. The former perches in very exposed situations, usually with the wings elevated, and the latter - even though at some of the same water bodies - typically perches lower and more out of the wind. It perches with the wings level or depressed most of the time. B. herbida, which occurs widely with B. furcata, is more like B. gravida. I think T. pallidinervis perches out in more exposed areas than many other Trithemis, and the majority of species of that genus that I have seen typically perch with wings depressed. This sort of discussion of comparative natural history is why I initiated Odonata-l many years ago. Nowadays, with so many people watching odonates, we can communicate about them worldwide and learn many things that weren't known, for example, when Philip Corbet was writing his big book. Dennis On Jan 8, 2012, at 2:38 PM, Jim Johnson wrote: > Hi Dennis, > > The rain streaks in that photo are almost sideways, so it must have been pretty windy at that moment too. I would assume that that was a significant factor in this case. This individual appears to be a very fresh adult and maybe that’s a factor too. > > I’m not familiar with this species so I just did a quick Internet search for photos. It seems that individuals of this species frequently perch with the wings held at an upward angle. Here are a couple of sites which came up near the top of the search results: > > http://odonata-malaysia.blogspot.com/2010/06/trithemis-pallidinervis.html > http://mandysmlee.multiply.com/photos/album/98/Libellulidae_-_Trithemis_pallidinervis > > The second one has a photo of one with the wings closed even more so than the National Geographic example. I imagine that the combination of behavior and wind (and perhaps immaturity) explain why the wings are up so high. > > Cheers, > > Jim Johnson > Vancouver, Washington > http://odonata.bogfoot.net/ > http://nwdragonflier.blogspot.com/ > > > From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Dennis Paulson > Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2012 2:07 PM > To: Odonata-l > Subject: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings > > There are statements in the literature such as "once a dragonfly opens its wings, it never closes them again." There are a few genera of anisopterans (Cordulephya, Zenithoptera) that routinely perch with closed wings, but otherwise you don't see such a thing. I have seen a number of dragonflies asleep at night, and their wings were open. > > So this winning photo in a National Geographic photo contest is quite interesting: > > http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2012/01/national_geographic_photograph.html > > Unless the photographer had some way to fake it, which doesn't seem likely, this dragonfly (Trithemis pallidinervis) has closed its wings when it started to rain rather than flying away. This makes sense, but I didn't know it occurred. Has anyone else seen anything like this? Most dragonfly watchers aren't out in the rain! > > ----- > Dennis Paulson > 1724 NE 98 St. > Seattle, WA 98115 > 206-528-1382 > dennispaulson AT comcast.net > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: dragonfly closes wings From: Dave McShaffrey <mcshaffd AT marietta.edu> Date: Sun, 8 Jan 2012 17:48:52 -0500 Dennis - are you sure the wings are closed? Might it have been beating the wings, slowly, to keep its balance against the rain and wind? Dave McShaffrey Department of Biology and Environmental Science Marietta College Marietta, OH 45750 mcshaffd AT marietta.edu www.marietta.edu/~mcshaffd 740-376-4743 From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Dennis Paulson Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2012 5:07 PM To: Odonata-l Subject: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings There are statements in the literature such as "once a dragonfly opens its wings, it never closes them again." There are a few genera of anisopterans (Cordulephya, Zenithoptera) that routinely perch with closed wings, but otherwise you don't see such a thing. I have seen a number of dragonflies asleep at night, and their wings were open. So this winning photo in a National Geographic photo contest is quite interesting: http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2012/01/national_geographic_photograph.html Unless the photographer had some way to fake it, which doesn't seem likely, this dragonfly (Trithemis pallidinervis) has closed its wings when it started to rain rather than flying away. This makes sense, but I didn't know it occurred. Has anyone else seen anything like this? Most dragonfly watchers aren't out in the rain! ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: dragonfly closes wings From: Jim Johnson <jt_johnson AT comcast.net> Date: Sun, 8 Jan 2012 14:38:58 -0800 Hi Dennis, The rain streaks in that photo are almost sideways, so it must have been pretty windy at that moment too. I would assume that that was a significant factor in this case. This individual appears to be a very fresh adult and maybe that's a factor too. I'm not familiar with this species so I just did a quick Internet search for photos. It seems that individuals of this species frequently perch with the wings held at an upward angle. Here are a couple of sites which came up near the top of the search results: http://odonata-malaysia.blogspot.com/2010/06/trithemis-pallidinervis.html http://mandysmlee.multiply.com/photos/album/98/Libellulidae_-_Trithemis_pall idinervis The second one has a photo of one with the wings closed even more so than the National Geographic example. I imagine that the combination of behavior and wind (and perhaps immaturity) explain why the wings are up so high. Cheers, Jim Johnson Vancouver, Washington http://odonata.bogfoot.net/ http://nwdragonflier.blogspot.com/ From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Dennis Paulson Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2012 2:07 PM To: Odonata-l Subject: [Odonata-l] dragonfly closes wings There are statements in the literature such as "once a dragonfly opens its wings, it never closes them again." There are a few genera of anisopterans (Cordulephya, Zenithoptera) that routinely perch with closed wings, but otherwise you don't see such a thing. I have seen a number of dragonflies asleep at night, and their wings were open. So this winning photo in a National Geographic photo contest is quite interesting: http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2012/01/national_geographic_photograph.html Unless the photographer had some way to fake it, which doesn't seem likely, this dragonfly (Trithemis pallidinervis) has closed its wings when it started to rain rather than flying away. This makes sense, but I didn't know it occurred. Has anyone else seen anything like this? Most dragonfly watchers aren't out in the rain! ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: dragonfly closes wings From: The Dragonfly Woman <thedragonflywoman AT gmail.com> Date: Sun, 8 Jan 2012 15:31:23 -0700 Odonate responses to storms are my favorite behaviors to observe, so I have been out in the rain watching dragonflies many times. I've never seen one fold its wings back in rains like this, so I guess I had assumed that wind was blowing the dragonfly's wings back in the photo instead of the dragonfly intentionally holding them up. The raindrops are moving nearly horizontally and the plant is sitting at an angle, which suggests windy conditions. The caption also states that the rain was sudden and winds often accompany sudden rains, so maybe the dragonfly simply didn't have a chance to seek shelter and just held on as it began to rain. That said, I've only observed a handful of dragonfly species in rainy conditions so far, so it's possible that this species does things differently. I'm interested to hear what others have to contribute! Chris Goforth Tucson, AZ On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 3:06 PM, Dennis Paulson wrote: > There are statements in the literature such as "once a dragonfly opens its > wings, it never closes them again." There are a few genera of anisopterans ( > *Cordulephya*, *Zenithoptera*) that routinely perch with closed wings, > but otherwise you don't see such a thing. I have seen a number of > dragonflies asleep at night, and their wings were open. > > So this winning photo in a National Geographic photo contest is quite > interesting: > > > http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2012/01/national_geographic_photograph.html > > Unless the photographer had some way to fake it, which doesn't seem > likely, this dragonfly (*Trithemis pallidinervis*) has closed its wings > when it started to rain rather than flying away. This makes sense, but I > didn't know it occurred. Has anyone else seen anything like this? Most > dragonfly watchers aren't out in the rain! > > ----- > Dennis Paulson > 1724 NE 98 St. > Seattle, WA 98115 > 206-528-1382 > dennispaulson AT comcast.net > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > >_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: dragonfly closes wings From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Sun, 8 Jan 2012 14:06:52 -0800 There are statements in the literature such as "once a dragonfly opens its wings, it never closes them again." There are a few genera of anisopterans (Cordulephya, Zenithoptera) that routinely perch with closed wings, but otherwise you don't see such a thing. I have seen a number of dragonflies asleep at night, and their wings were open. So this winning photo in a National Geographic photo contest is quite interesting: http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2012/01/national_geographic_photograph.html Unless the photographer had some way to fake it, which doesn't seem likely, this dragonfly (Trithemis pallidinervis) has closed its wings when it started to rain rather than flying away. This makes sense, but I didn't know it occurred. Has anyone else seen anything like this? Most dragonfly watchers aren't out in the rain! ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: A Chilean damselfly quandary From: Eric LoPresti <lopresti.eric AT gmail.com> Date: Sun, 8 Jan 2012 14:33:04 -0300 Howdy, Having been transplanted (temporarily) from Mass to Chiloe Island, Chile, (northern patagonia) I have been catching/photographing odes here since October (see: here & here ) . I have been able to get most identified (6 to species, 1 to genus and then the one detailed below). The region is really hurting in species numbers (birds and butterflies, too), but the species that are here are pretty common. In the beginning of December, I found a female damsel that I immediately assumed was an *Ischnura* - having experience with the genus back in the states. There are two known from Chile – *I. fluviatilis *and* ramburii, *so I thought nothing more of the sighting and just figured I could deduce the species when I found a male - though I searched unsuccessfully for it again until the 6th of January, when I found a bunch of *Ischnura*-esque males near a little roadside pond. However, I was immediately struck by the fact that the original female had an interrupted antehumeral stripe (like* I. posita* at home), but these males had only a partial antehumeral stripe - it was not interrupted, just incomplete. The pictures are here ( http://www.flickr.com/photos/26099887 AT N03/6660574589/in/photostream) stitched into one big pic. So I turned to the key (Heckman: Encyclopedia of South American Aquatic Insects) and got to this step: “The antehumeral stripes of the males are blue and always interrupted, with the shorter segment on the posterior part of the synthorax. The superior anal appendage of the male has a prominent apical tooth (Fig. 3.1.364). .......................................................................Cyanallagma Kennedy, 1920..p. 533 - The antehumeral stripes of the male are not blue, or, if they are, they are not interrupted (Fig. 3.1.335). ...................................................................................32” The female therefore, cannot be treated here, but the males can, and the antehumeral stripe would indicate moving on in the key (the photos do not show it well, but it seems no apical tooth is present - I would go out and check, but it is raining like hell). So when I move on to the next step it keys out as *Ischnura*. OK – I am sort of fine with this (as the stripe is blue and not interrupted). The two species known from Chile *fluviatilis* and *ramburii* are a bit odd fits though. Because both have huge ranges, there are hundreds of photographs for each species online – showing complete antehumeral stripes. If I use the key, the males sort-of key out to *fluviatilis* (the anal appendages are broadly rounded, but don’t match the diagram all that well). All in all, the males seem to key out to *I. fluviatilis*, but on the basis of the internet, I am not convinced. If I were wrong on the genus and key them through *Cyanallagma*, I get to this step: “3. The third though seventh abdominal segments are blue with a black dorsal fringe on the anterior margin and along the midline (*Fig. 3.1.633*). ....................4 - The sixth abdominal segment is mainly black dorsally. The lateral membrane of the first penis segment has no more than a few short setae (*Fig. 3.1.634 *). .....5” Which certainly fits option 2 – and thus bypasses *C. interruptum*, the only Chilean member of the genus (which doesn’t fit even if I move the other way). There is no female key to this genus – so perhaps the female could be this. I am by no means an expert (it is just an fun project - I am studying birds down here) and I'm that someone here has experience with the species/genera involved and can shed some light on this. If anyone has interest in Chilean odes, I have lots of pictures/observations that I would love to get to someone that can use them. Thanks, Eric LoPresti_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Odonata-L: Scans of E. Schmidt's (1915) plates From: Matti Hamalainen <matti.hamalainen AT helsinki.fi> Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2011 21:22:54 +0200 Dear Dirk and others, Best thanks to Dirk for sending the scanned figures from the paper by Schmidt. It is easiest to read the text online at http://www.biodiversitylibrary.org/item/43582#page/1/mode/1up Schmidt's paper is on pages 87-200. The figures and figure legends can be seen at the end of the whole issue after the page 630. However, it is easier to consult the figures (added with scientific names) from the file sent by Dirk. Best wishes, Matti ----- Original Message ----- From: Dirk Gassmann To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2011 7:03 PM Subject: [Odonata-l] Odonata-L: Scans of E. Schmidt's (1915) plates Dear Jessica, Dennis, Angelo, Fred, Bill (and other interested odonatologists), herewith, I send the scans of Schmidt's plates which apparently had not been included in the pdf of the paper which can be accessed online (thanks to Angelo for forwarding the following link): http://www.archive.org/download/zoologischejahrb1639jena/zoologischejahrb1639jena.pdf You find the scans of the plates as an attachment to this mail. Schmidt was working with transparencies which are laid on the drawings. I have scanned the plates both with and without the transparencies. Hope this is of interest. With best wishes, Dirk -- Dirk Gassmann, PhD Research Associate Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity (NCB Naturalis) P.O. Box 9517 NL-2300 RA Leiden The Netherlands e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Odonata-L: Scans of E. Schmidt's (1915) plates From: Dirk Gassmann <dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2011 17:03:42 +0000 Dear Jessica, Dennis, Angelo, Fred, Bill (and other interested odonatologists),   herewith, I send the scans of Schmidt's plates which apparently had not been included in the pdf of the paper which can be accessed online (thanks to Angelo for forwarding the following link):   http://www.archive.org/download/zoologischejahrb1639jena/zoologischejahrb1639jena.pdf You find the scans of the plates as an attachment to this mail. Schmidt was working with transparencies which are laid on the drawings. I have scanned the plates both with and without the transparencies. Hope this is of interest. With best wishes, Dirk -- Dirk Gassmann, PhD Research Associate Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity (NCB Naturalis) P.O. Box 9517 NL-2300 RA Leiden The Netherlands e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Jamaica and Dominican Republic From: Adolfo Cordero Rivera <adolfocordero AT mundo-r.com> Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2011 18:38:59 +0100 Dear colleagues Next year we would like to sample Jamaica and the Dominican Republic. We are specially interested in collecting a few specimens of Hypolestes, but also other Zygopterans for a comparative study of genital structures. Any suggestions for places to visit? Also, any idea who to contact for asking for collecting permits? My previous posting on Epiophlebia was premature. The paper is in press and no pdf available yet. Merry Christmas! Here is the abstract: A third species of the relict family Epiophlebiidae discovered in China ( Odonata: Epiproctophora) Li, J.-K. a c , Nel, A. b [image: Email this author] , Zhang, X.-P. c [image: Email this author] , Fleck, G. b , Gao, M.-X. d , Lin, L. c , Zhou, J. c [image: Correspondence address] a Vientiane, Laos b Entomologie, Muséum National d'Histoire Naturelle, Paris, France c Key Laboratory of Remote Sensing Monitoring of Geographic Environment, College of Heilongjiang Province, Harbin Normal University, Harbin, China d Department of Geography, Harbin University, Harbin Chian, China *Abstract: *Epiophlebia sinensis sp.n., a third species of the relict odonatan family Epiophlebiidae, is described from two male adults collected in Heilongjiang province, China. The new species lives in an environment rather similar to that of the two other species, E. superstes and E. laidlawi, i.e. along cold streams in a coniferous and deciduous forest. Possible explanations for the lack of fossil Epiophlebiidae and the biogeography of these damsel-dragonflies are proposed. © 2011 The Authors. Systematic Entomology © 2011 The Royal Entomological Society. *This article has not been published yet.* [image: Correspondence address]Nel, A.; Andre Nel, CNRS UMR 7205, CP 50, Entomologie, Muséum National d'Histoire Naturelle, 45 Rue Bu, ; email:anel AT mnhn.fr Regards -- Adolfo Cordero Rivera Grupo de Ecoloxía Evolutiva e da Conservación Universidade de Vigo, EUET Forestal, Campus Universitario A Xunqueira 36005 Pontevedra, Galiza, España / Spain Tel. +34 986801926. Fax: +34986 801907 Móbil: +34 647343183 -- Adolfo Cordero Rivera Grupo de Ecoloxía Evolutiva e da Conservación Universidade de Vigo, EUET Forestal, Campus Universitario A Xunqueira 36005 Pontevedra, Galiza, España / Spain Tel. +34 986801926. Fax: +34986 801907 Móbil: +34 647343183_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: a third Epiophleia discovered! From: Adolfo Cordero Rivera <adolfocordero AT mundo-r.com> Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2011 17:32:18 +0100 Just published, a new species of Epiophlebia from China: http://www.scopus.com/record/display.url?eid=2-s2.0-80055014899&origin=resultslist&sort=plf-f&src=s&st1=odonata&sid=mWYogCTlunqRy8W0MSXjSLz%3a30&sot=b&sdt=b&sl=22&s=TITLE-ABS-KEY%28odonata%29&relpos=18&relpos=18&searchTerm=TITLE-ABS-KEY%28odonata%29# Regards -- Adolfo Cordero Rivera Grupo de Ecoloxía Evolutiva e da Conservación Universidade de Vigo, EUET Forestal, Campus Universitario A Xunqueira 36005 Pontevedra, Galiza, España / Spain Tel. +34 986801926. Fax: +34986 801907 Móbil: +34 647343183_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: For the birders Egretta thula with wild horses From: Martha Smith <scldrgnfly AT gmail.com> Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2011 10:58:54 -0500 I thought you might like to see my Christmas message with the wild horses of Carova Beach, NC! At the very end you see the snowy egret(Egretta thula, I think) land on the mother horse's back while she nurses her day-old foal! And then it gets on the ground to follow her pecking the insects off of her legs! I don't think I see any dragonflies, though, but this is where I saw the mass emergence in 2009, and this is the colt that was born on the same day of the emergence. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZnpNzXOm1E Martha Edwards Smith_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Fwd: RFI: Asian Odonate researchers From: Joshua Rose <opihi AT mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 21 Dec 2011 12:54:48 -0500 Howdy folks, Please see below and reply to Morgan if you know of any researchers currently studying Chinese odonate ecology or systematics. Thanks! JSR Joshua Rose, Ph.D. Amherst, MA opihi AT mindspring.com http://bugguide.net/user/view/2399 http://www.facebook.com/opihi Begin forwarded message: > From: Morgan McClure > Date: December 21, 2011 12:48:06 AM EST > To: > Subject: Asian Odonates > > > > Josh et al: > > I would like to know who, if anyone, is doing any research on China's odonates; systematics or ecology? > > Morgan A. McClure, MSc, MAt > Professor of English Language > Department of Foreign Language > Nanchong Professional Technic College > Nanchong, Sichuan, P. R. China > 637000 > __,_._,___ _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: DSA 2012 South Carolina Website up From: Marion Dobbs <spreadwing AT mac.com> Date: Sat, 10 Dec 2011 17:53:32 -0500 What Chris means to say is that after he did all the hard work of planning and organizing the meeting and gathering the information that needed to be got out, I had the easy job of putting a little structure to that data and throwing it on the web. Being a Firefox user, I don't always think about how things can differ in appearance or function across various browsers and computing platforms. I was reminded of that fact during the course of this project. We discovered, for instance, that text doesn't necessarily scale up correctly when you zoom in Safari. In Internet Explorer, the feature photos on two of the three welcome pages appear surrounded, not by lovely, soft, cloud-like (or dripping-paint-like, depending on your perspective) frames, but rather by dark, harsh, ugly blobs. I'm sure there's more. So, I herewith shift blame for anything that doesn't look good or work correctly to the browser in use. This works out pretty well for me. Now nothing is my fault. Marion Dobbs Rome (Floyd Co.) GA spreadwing AT mac.com pond_damsel AT comcast.net http://www.mamomi.net http://mariondobbs.smugmug.com "The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason."_Benjamin Franklin On Dec 10, 2011, at 4:33 PM, Chris Hill wrote: > Hi and pardon the crossposting, > > Thanks to the efforts of Marion Dobbs, there is now a website up for > the Dragonfly Society of the Americas meeting coming next May in > Florence, SC. The webpage is in the "beta" stage, with more to come, > but there is travel info, hotel info, pre- and post-meeting trip info > and a tentative schedule up. Oh, and also a registration page. > Please register some time if you're planning on coming. > > http://web.me.com/ecurlew/DSA_2012/Welcome_DSA_2012.html > > Only 145 days 6 hours and 27 minutes until the meeting! > > Best, > > Chris Hill > > ************************************************************************ > Christopher E. Hill > Biology Department > Coastal Carolina University > Conway, SC 29528-1954 > 843-349-2567 > chill AT coastal.edu > http://ww2.coastal.edu/chill/chill.htm > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Euphaea From: Guillon <benoit.guillon AT meslibellules.fr> Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2011 11:19:29 +0100 I need your help for etymology again, for Euphaea (masoni or splendens...). Is it possible that the etymology of the genus name (and the family name) comes from the greek words “eu” , well, and "phae", dark or dusky? Indeed, these dragonflies are very dark, especially Euphaea splendens. It's a supposition and I would like your opinion. Thank you! Benoît Guillon. _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: World Dragonfly Day(s)/Week(s) From: Martha Smith <scldrgnfly AT gmail.com> Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2011 22:15:01 -0500 I hope that these observations are relevant in trying to determine the best date(s) for a World Dragonfly Day(s)/Week. Since 2001, when I noted the first day that year (June 12th at 1:45 p.m.) "Mr. Dragonfly" appeared/came back to the perch on the rope above our pool, I began to keep track of "his" reappearance. Since that time, a male(s) Libellula vibrans has taken its/their perch and stayed for the whole summer in this small enclosed area, only leaving the area for short periods of time to find mates for ovipositing in the protected area adjacent to the pool. However, sometimes there are breaks of several days when it is gone, possibly, mating in another habitat, during times of less optimal conditions in our habitat. Every year, with the exceptions of 2010 and 2011, the Libellula vibrans appeared within a three day window between June 10th, 11th and 12th. In 2010 and 2011, while temperatures were higher and we experienced severe drought conditions, the dominant dragonfly appeared about the 7th of June. This does not mean dragonflies did not pass through the area, but it IS when the Libellula vibrans took up permanent residence for the summer. Now, I begin to come to my point, and another set of observations that may help in deciding when to set the date(s). For a long time, I have seemed to notice a much heightened level of reproductive activity around the 26th of June, in fact, it is often the most productive reproductive period in our habitat. From that date in June, it is almost as if the heightened reproductive activity does come in 3-4 week waves, tapering off as the summer wanes. I have hesitated to pose this thought, because I really need to go through my videos to be truly positive of the accuracy of this observation. Frankly, I was thinking this is due to the position of the sun in our habitat. That was until, I experienced something that I thought was extremely interesting in relation to my previous questions. During the week of June 21st - June 28th of 2009 we were at Carova Beach, NC on the Outer Banks one of the places in NC where the horses run wild. Mid-week (I can check the exact date), on the very same day, there was not only a mass emergence of dragonflies in the bushes right in front of our "cottage," but also, right on the beach, within walking distance, a baby colt was born. A day or two earlier, another colt had been born, but all three "births" occurred within the very same week, essentially, during the date-window I thought I was observing of increased reproductive activity in our habitat in the Northern Coastal Plain of NC. Off-hand, I have been unsuccessful in finding the tidal charts for that year, but I have found the moon phases which are: *Moon Phases, June 2009* Full Moon – June 7, 18:12 Last Quarter – June 15, 22:15 New Moon – June 22, 19:35 First Quarter – June 29, 11:28 Would any of you know if this has an affect on these behaviors? Now, my final idea. It would be very interesting, to get the world involved in a universal count and observation of reproductive behaviors, with the idea of eventually being able to focus on the level of reproductive activity in relation to the 3-4 week waves I think I have been seeing. Due to the 2 or 3 day windows I have observed, I think a World Dragonfly set of 2 opposing weeks each year would be the most comprehensive, since we are dealing with both sides of the world. This way, the two weeks that are equal in time, moon phase and "season" could be observed with a much more rational approach, hopefully without bias. At least, with this approach, we might be able to start focusing on the real diurnal behaviors as they relate to reproduction universally. I just thought of something funny. You know how water drains in the opposite direction "Down-Under," it would be funny if dragonfly wings moved in the opposite direction on each side of the world. LOL! We do need to do something about this! Just think of the interest in Odonata it would generate. it would be REALLY cool if we could get every country in the world, or, at least some to produce postage stamps at the same time! What a "collector" opportunity!! Thanks everyone! Martha Edwards Smith I have a video I am working on of this amazing place, but here's the link to one of my daughter's pictures of the colt the day it was born! http://share.shutterfly.com/share/received/detail.sfly?sid=0AaM2jNi5asmTno&imageIndex=38&fid=5ea33c3059c94dae _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: RE: World Dragonfly Day(s)/Week(s) From: Martha Smith <scldrgnfly AT yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2011 22:15:01 -0500 I hope that these observations are relevant in trying to determine the best date(s) for a World Dragonfly Day(s)/Week. Since 2001, when I noted the first day that year (June 12th at 1:45 p.m.) "Mr. Dragonfly" appeared/came back to the perch on the rope above our pool, I began to keep track of "his" reappearance. Since that time, a male(s) Libellula vibrans has taken its/their perch and stayed for the whole summer in this small enclosed area, only leaving the area for short periods of time to find mates for ovipositing in the protected area adjacent to the pool. However, sometimes there are breaks of several days when it is gone, possibly, mating in another habitat, during times of less optimal conditions in our habitat. Every year, with the exceptions of 2010 and 2011, the Libellula vibrans appeared within a three day window between June 10th, 11th and 12th. In 2010 and 2011, while temperatures were higher and we experienced severe drought conditions, the dominant dragonfly appeared about the 7th of June. This does not mean dragonflies did not pass through the area, but it IS when the Libellula vibrans took up permanent residence for the summer. Now, I begin to come to my point, and another set of observations that may help in deciding when to set the date(s). For a long time, I have seemed to notice a much heightened level of reproductive activity around the 26th of June, in fact, it is often the most productive reproductive period in our habitat. From that date in June, it is almost as if the heightened reproductive activity does come in 3-4 week waves, tapering off as the summer wanes. I have hesitated to pose this thought, because I really need to go through my videos to be truly positive of the accuracy of this observation. Frankly, I was thinking this is due to the position of the sun in our habitat. That was until, I experienced something that I thought was extremely interesting in relation to my previous questions. During the week of June 21st - June 28th of 2009 we were at Carova Beach, NC on the Outer Banks one of the places in NC where the horses run wild. Mid-week (I can check the exact date), on the very same day, there was not only a mass emergence of dragonflies in the bushes right in front of our "cottage," but also, right on the beach, within walking distance, a baby colt was born. A day or two earlier, another colt had been born, but all three "births" occurred within the very same week, essentially, during the date-window I thought I was observing of increased reproductive activity in our habitat in the Northern Coastal Plain of NC. Off-hand, I have been unsuccessful in finding the tidal charts for that year, but I have found the moon phases which are: *Moon Phases, June 2009* Full Moon – June 7, 18:12 Last Quarter – June 15, 22:15 New Moon – June 22, 19:35 First Quarter – June 29, 11:28 Would any of you know if this has an affect on these behaviors? Now, my final idea. It would be very interesting, to get the world involved in a universal count and observation of reproductive behaviors, with the idea of eventually being able to focus on the level of reproductive activity in relation to the 3-4 week waves I think I have been seeing. Due to the 2 or 3 day windows I have observed, I think a World Dragonfly set of 2 opposing weeks each year would be the most comprehensive, since we are dealing with both sides of the world. This way, the two weeks that are equal in time, moon phase and "season" could be observed with a much more rational approach, hopefully without bias. At least, with this approach, we might be able to start focusing on the real diurnal behaviors as they relate to reproduction universally. I just thought of something funny. You know how water drains in the opposite direction "Down-Under," it would be funny if dragonfly wings moved in the opposite direction on each side of the world. LOL! We do need to do something about this! Just think of the interest in Odonata it would generate. it would be REALLY cool if we could get every country in the world, or, at least some to produce postage stamps at the same time! What a "collector" opportunity!! Thanks everyone! Martha Edwards Smith I have a video I am working on of this amazing place, but here's the link to one of my daughter's pictures of the colt the day it was born! http://share.shutterfly.com/share/received/detail.sfly?sid=0AaM2jNi5asmTno&imageIndex=38&fid=5ea33c3059c94dae Subject: Re: Dragonflies of North America From: IORI <iodonata AT bellsouth.net> Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2011 13:56:51 -0500 Please do not send any advanced payments until we have a more definite pprojected publishing date thanks Bill Mauffray International Odonata Research Institute PO Box 147100 Gainesville FL 32614-7100 352-219-3141 cell iodonata AT gmail.com http://www.iodonata.net -----Original Message----- From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of IORI Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2011 1:29 PM To: 'Joshua Rose'; 'Odonata List Server' Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Dragonflies of North America Actually publication date has been delayed- possibly into mid 2012 Bill Mauffray International Odonata Research Institute PO Box 147100 Gainesville FL 32614-7100 352-219-3141 cell iodonata AT gmail.com http://www.iodonata.net -----Original Message----- From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Rose Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2011 12:09 PM To: Odonata List Server Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Dragonflies of North America The IORI website is taking advance orders and expects publication next month: http://www.iodonata.net/ Cheers, JSR Joshua Rose, Ph.D. Amherst, MA opihi AT mindspring.com http://bugguide.net/user/view/2399 http://www.facebook.com/opihi On Nov 30, 2011, at 11:54 AM, George Sims wrote: > Does anyone have a potential release date for the new edition of Dragonflies of North America? > _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Dragonflies of North America From: IORI <iodonata AT bellsouth.net> Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2011 13:28:36 -0500 Actually publication date has been delayed- possibly into mid 2012 Bill Mauffray International Odonata Research Institute PO Box 147100 Gainesville FL 32614-7100 352-219-3141 cell iodonata AT gmail.com http://www.iodonata.net -----Original Message----- From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Rose Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2011 12:09 PM To: Odonata List Server Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Dragonflies of North America The IORI website is taking advance orders and expects publication next month: http://www.iodonata.net/ Cheers, JSR Joshua Rose, Ph.D. Amherst, MA opihi AT mindspring.com http://bugguide.net/user/view/2399 http://www.facebook.com/opihi On Nov 30, 2011, at 11:54 AM, George Sims wrote: > Does anyone have a potential release date for the new edition of Dragonflies of North America? > _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Dragonflies of North America From: Joshua Rose <opihi AT mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2011 12:08:31 -0500 The IORI website is taking advance orders and expects publication next month: http://www.iodonata.net/ Cheers, JSR Joshua Rose, Ph.D. Amherst, MA opihi AT mindspring.com http://bugguide.net/user/view/2399 http://www.facebook.com/opihi On Nov 30, 2011, at 11:54 AM, George Sims wrote: > Does anyone have a potential release date for the new edition of Dragonflies of North America? > _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Dragonflies of North America From: George Sims <georgesims AT hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2011 10:54:18 -0600 Does anyone have a potential release date for the new edition of Dragonflies of North America? > From: odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 03:55:08 -0800 > > Send Odonata-l mailing list submissions to > odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu > > You can reach the person managing the list at > odonata-l-owner AT listhost.ups.edu > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Odonata-l digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Paper request (Frederico A.A. Lencioni) > 2. Re: Paper request (IORI) > 3. Re: Paper request (Dirk Gassmann) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 01:18:02 -0200 > From: "Frederico A.A. Lencioni" > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > To: Dirk Gassmann , > > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > I also want a copy of this paper if possible. > Thanks, > > Fred > > From: Dirk Gassmann > Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2011 10:57 AM > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > Dear Odonatologists, > > Does anyone have a pdf or scan of the following paper and would be so kind to forward it to me by e-mail? > > Schmidt, E., 1934: > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > Zool. Jahrb. 39: 144, pi. 11 fig. 45. > > I had trouble to find it, also because there seems to be some confusion in the literature > about where and when the paper was published. So, the data given above are rather approximative. > > Thank you in advance! > > Best wishes, > Dirk Gassmann > > > -- > Dirk Gassmann, PhD > Research Associate > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity > (NCB Naturalis) > P.O. Box 9517 > NL-2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl > dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20111129/da1aa91b/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2011 22:57:02 -0500 > From: IORI > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > To: "'Frederico A.A. Lencioni'" , "'Dirk > Gassmann'" , > Message-ID: <019e01ccae4a$f470fc40$dd52f4c0$ AT net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Fred, Dirk, et al: > > > > This is what I have: > > > > I have > > > > Schmidt, E., 1915: > > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > > Zool. Jahrb. 39: pp 87- 200, tafel 9-11 (with labeled wax paper? Overlays) > figs 1-84. > > > > Please tell me only the pages and figures you need. > > > > P 144 is Legion: Calopteryx and part of Legion Euphaea > > Taf. 11 figs 40-46 goes with Calopteryx. > > > > > > > > Bill Mauffray > > International Odonata Research Institute > > PO Box 147100 > > Gainesville FL 32614-7100 > > 352-219-3141 cell > > iodonata AT gmail.com > > http://www.iodonata.net > > > > From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu > [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Frederico A.A. > Lencioni > Sent: Monday, November 28, 2011 10:18 PM > To: Dirk Gassmann; odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > > > I also want a copy of this paper if possible. > > Thanks, > > > > Fred > > > > From: Dirk Gassmann > > Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2011 10:57 AM > > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > Subject: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > > > Dear Odonatologists, > > > > Does anyone have a pdf or scan of the following paper and would be so kind > to forward it to me by e-mail? > > > > Schmidt, E., 1934: > > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > > Zool. Jahrb. 39: 144, pi. 11 fig. 45. > > > > I had trouble to find it, also because there seems to be some confusion in > the literature > > about where and when the paper was published. So, the data given above are > rather approximative. > > > > Thank you in advance! > > > > Best wishes, > > Dirk Gassmann > > > > > > -- > Dirk Gassmann, PhD > Research Associate > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity > (NCB Naturalis) > P.O. Box 9517 > NL-2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl > dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com > > _____ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20111128/9871590c/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 11:55:04 +0000 > From: Dirk Gassmann > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > To: IORI , "'Frederico A.A. Lencioni'" > , "odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu" > > Message-ID: > <1322567704.22335.YahooMailNeo AT web29511.mail.ird.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Dear Bill, > ? > thanks again for looking up the reference! > It so happens that I finally found Schmidt's?paper in (another part) of our library. > Since I?intend to make a photocopy and a scan of?the whole?article anyway, > I offer to send the scan of the (large) paper to Fred and other interested odonatologists. > Will take some time though. > ? > Thanks again, > Dirk > > > ________________________________ > Von: IORI > An: 'Frederico A.A. Lencioni' ; 'Dirk Gassmann' ; odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Gesendet: 4:57 Dienstag, 29.November 2011 > Betreff: RE: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > > Fred, Dirk, et al: > ? > This is what I have: > ? > I have > ? > Schmidt, E., 1915: > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > Zool. Jahrb. 39: pp 87- 200, tafel 9-11 (with labeled wax paper? Overlays) ?figs 1-84.? > ? > Please tell me only the pages and figures you need. > ? > P 144 is Legion: Calopteryx and part of Legion Euphaea > Taf. 11 figs 40-46 goes with Calopteryx. > ? > ? > ? > Bill Mauffray > International Odonata Research Institute > PO Box 147100 > Gainesville FL 32614-7100 > 352-219-3141 cell > iodonata AT gmail.com > http://www.iodonata.net > ? > From:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Frederico A.A. Lencioni > Sent: Monday, November 28, 2011 10:18 PM > To: Dirk Gassmann; odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > ? > I also want a copy of this paper if possible. > Thanks, > ? > Fred > ? > From:Dirk Gassmann > Sent:Sunday, November 27, 2011 10:57 AM > To:odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject:[Odonata-l] Paper request > ? > Dear Odonatologists, > ? > Does anyone have a pdf or scan of the following paper and would be so kind to forward it to me by e-mail? > ? > Schmidt, E., 1934: > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > Zool. Jahrb. 39: 144, pi. 11 fig. 45.? > ? > I had trouble to find? it, also because there seems to be some confusion in the literature > about where and when the paper was published. So, the data given above are rather approximative. > ? > Thank you in advance! > ? > Best wishes, > Dirk Gassmann > ? > ? > -- > Dirk Gassmann, PhD > Research Associate > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity > (NCB Naturalis) > P.O. Box 9517 > NL-2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl > dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com > > ________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20111129/1d855c34/attachment.html > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > > End of Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 > ***************************************** _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Schmidt paper From: Dirk Gassmann <dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com> Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2011 16:19:00 +0000 Dear Angelo,   thank you very much for sending the link. That's the right paper. I didn't know that it was available online. However, it appears to me that the plates with Schmidt's drawings are missing from the pdf. I will scan them and send it to the people who have already declared their interest in the paper.   Thanks, Dirk -- Dirk Gassmann, PhD Research Associate Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity (NCB Naturalis) P.O. Box 9517 NL-2300 RA Leiden The Netherlands e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com ________________________________ Von: Ângelo P. Pinto An: Odonata List_UPS Gesendet: 3:11 Mittwoch, 30.November 2011 Betreff: Re: [Odonata-l] Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 (APPinto) Dear colleagues,   First all, I would like to thanks for all responses to my request concerning to Tombo paper.   The paper asked by Dirk was published under a very confusing journal title. I do not know if you already have a copy... In anyway the title Zoologische jahrbucher has fused and/or was partitioned in some journals, one of them is now Zoologische Anzeiger and another one with the same title became Zoology. Based in the date and number of volume very likely is an older issue of Zoologische Anzeiger, obviously before have this name. I am in doubt but if it's the same paper cited by Bill it can be downloadable through this link: http://www.archive.org/download/zoologischejahrb1639jena/zoologischejahrb1639jena.pdf). If is not this one, and you still interested I can check in the library of Museum, but just in next week.   Best wishes, Ângelo Pinto > From: odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 03:55:08 -0800 > > Send Odonata-l mailing list submissions to > odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu > > You can reach the person managing the list at > odonata-l-owner AT listhost.ups.edu > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Odonata-l digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Paper request (Frederico A.A. Lencioni) > 2. Re: Paper request (IORI) > 3. Re: Paper request (Dirk Gassmann) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 01:18:02 -0200 > From: "Frederico A.A. Lencioni" > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > To: Dirk Gassmann , > > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > I also want a copy of this paper if possible. > Thanks, > > Fred > > From: Dirk Gassmann > Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2011 10:57 AM > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > Dear Odonatologists, > > Does anyone have a pdf or scan of the following paper and would be so kind to forward it to me by e-mail? > > Schmidt, E., 1934: > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > Zool. Jahrb. 39: 144, pi. 11 fig. 45. > > I had trouble to find it, also because there seems to be some confusion in the literature > about where and when the paper was published. So, the data given above are rather approximative. > > Thank you in advance! > > Best wishes, > Dirk Gassmann > > > -- > Dirk Gassmann, PhD > Research Associate > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity > (NCB Naturalis) > P.O. Box 9517 > NL-2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl > dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20111129/da1aa91b/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2011 22:57:02 -0500 > From: IORI > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > To: "'Frederico A.A. Lencioni'" , "'Dirk > Gassmann'" , > Message-ID: <019e01ccae4a$f470fc40$dd52f4c0$ AT net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Fred, Dirk, et al: > > > > This is what I have: > > > > I have > > > > Schmidt, E., 1915: > > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > > Zool. Jahrb. 39: pp 87- 200, tafel 9-11 (with labeled wax paper? Overlays) > figs 1-84. > > > > Please tell me only the pages and figures you need. > > > > P 144 is Legion: Calopteryx and part of Legion Euphaea > > Taf. 11 figs 40-46 goes with Calopteryx. > > > > > > > > Bill Mauffray > > International Odonata Research Institute > > PO Box 147100 > > Gainesville FL 32614-7100 > > 352-219-3141 cell > > iodonata AT gmail.com > > http://www.iodonata.net > > > > From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu > [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Frederico A.A. > Lencioni > Sent: Monday, November 28, 2011 10:18 PM > To: Dirk Gassmann; odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > > > I also want a copy of this paper if possible. > > Thanks, > > > > Fred > > > > From: Dirk Gassmann > > Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2011 10:57 AM > > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > Subject: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > > > Dear Odonatologists, > > > > Does anyone have a pdf or scan of the following paper and would be so kind > to forward it to me by e-mail? > > > > Schmidt, E., 1934: > > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > > Zool. Jahrb. 39: 144, pi. 11 fig. 45. > > > > I had trouble to find it, also because there seems to be some confusion in > the literature > > about where and when the paper was published. So, the data given above are > rather approximative. > > > > Thank you in advance! > > > > Best wishes, > > Dirk Gassmann > > > > > > -- > Dirk Gassmann, PhD > Research Associate > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity > (NCB Naturalis) > P.O. Box 9517 > NL-2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl > dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com > > _____ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20111128/9871590c/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 11:55:04 +0000 > From: Dirk Gassmann > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > To: IORI , "'Frederico A.A. Lencioni'" > , "odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu" > > Message-ID: > <1322567704.22335.YahooMailNeo AT web29511.mail.ird.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Dear Bill, > ? > thanks again for looking up the reference! > It so happens that I finally found Schmidt's?paper in (another part) of our library. > Since I?intend to make a photocopy and a scan of?the whole?article anyway, > I offer to send the scan of the (large) paper to Fred and other interested odonatologists. > Will take some time though. > ? > Thanks again, > Dirk > > > ________________________________ > Von: IORI > An: 'Frederico A.A. Lencioni' ; 'Dirk Gassmann' ; odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Gesendet: 4:57 Dienstag, 29.November 2011 > Betreff: RE: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > > Fred, Dirk, et al: > ? > This is what I have: > ? > I have > ? > Schmidt, E., 1915: > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > Zool. Jahrb. 39: pp 87- 200, tafel 9-11 (with labeled wax paper? Overlays) ?figs 1-84.? > ? > Please tell me only the pages and figures you need. > ? > P 144 is Legion: Calopteryx and part of Legion Euphaea > Taf. 11 figs 40-46 goes with Calopteryx. > ? > ? > ? > Bill Mauffray > International Odonata Research Institute > PO Box 147100 > Gainesville FL 32614-7100 > 352-219-3141 cell > iodonata AT gmail.com > http://www.iodonata.net > ? > From:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Frederico A.A. Lencioni > Sent: Monday, November 28, 2011 10:18 PM > To: Dirk Gassmann; odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > ? > I also want a copy of this paper if possible. > Thanks, > ? > Fred > ? > From:Dirk Gassmann > Sent:Sunday, November 27, 2011 10:57 AM > To:odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject:[Odonata-l] Paper request > ? > Dear Odonatologists, > ? > Does anyone have a pdf or scan of the following paper and would be so kind to forward it to me by e-mail? > ? > Schmidt, E., 1934: > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > Zool. Jahrb. 39: 144, pi. 11 fig. 45.? > ? > I had trouble to find? it, also because there seems to be some confusion in the literature > about where and when the paper was published. So, the data given above are rather approximative. > ? > Thank you in advance! > ? > Best wishes, > Dirk Gassmann > ? > ? > -- > Dirk Gassmann, PhD > Research Associate > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity > (NCB Naturalis) > P.O. Box 9517 > NL-2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl > dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com > > ________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20111129/1d855c34/attachment.html > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > > End of Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 > ***************************************** _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 (APPinto) From: "Frederico A.A. Lencioni" <odonata AT uol.com.br> Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2011 03:59:57 -0200 Dear Angelo, Thank you very much for the link. Best wishes, Fred From: Ângelo P. Pinto Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2011 12:11 AM To: Odonata List_UPS Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 (APPinto) Dear colleagues, First all, I would like to thanks for all responses to my request concerning to Tombo paper. The paper asked by Dirk was published under a very confusing journal title. I do not know if you already have a copy... In anyway the title Zoologische jahrbucher has fused and/or was partitioned in some journals, one of them is now Zoologische Anzeiger and another one with the same title became Zoology. Based in the date and number of volume very likely is an older issue of Zoologische Anzeiger, obviously before have this name. I am in doubt but if it's the same paper cited by Bill it can be downloadable through this link: http://www.archive.org/download/zoologischejahrb1639jena/zoologischejahrb1639jena.pdf). If is not this one, and you still interested I can check in the library of Museum, but just in next week. Best wishes, Ângelo Pinto > From: odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 03:55:08 -0800 > > Send Odonata-l mailing list submissions to > odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu > > You can reach the person managing the list at > odonata-l-owner AT listhost.ups.edu > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Odonata-l digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Paper request (Frederico A.A. Lencioni) > 2. Re: Paper request (IORI) > 3. Re: Paper request (Dirk Gassmann) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 01:18:02 -0200 > From: "Frederico A.A. Lencioni" > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > To: Dirk Gassmann , > > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > I also want a copy of this paper if possible. > Thanks, > > Fred > > From: Dirk Gassmann > Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2011 10:57 AM > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > Dear Odonatologists, > > Does anyone have a pdf or scan of the following paper and would be so kind to forward it to me by e-mail? > > Schmidt, E., 1934: > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > Zool. Jahrb. 39: 144, pi. 11 fig. 45. > > I had trouble to find it, also because there seems to be some confusion in the literature > about where and when the paper was published. So, the data given above are rather approximative. > > Thank you in advance! > > Best wishes, > Dirk Gassmann > > > -- > Dirk Gassmann, PhD > Research Associate > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity > (NCB Naturalis) > P.O. Box 9517 > NL-2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl > dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20111129/da1aa91b/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2011 22:57:02 -0500 > From: IORI > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > To: "'Frederico A.A. Lencioni'" , "'Dirk > Gassmann'" , > Message-ID: <019e01ccae4a$f470fc40$dd52f4c0$ AT net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Fred, Dirk, et al: > > > > This is what I have: > > > > I have > > > > Schmidt, E., 1915: > > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > > Zool. Jahrb. 39: pp 87- 200, tafel 9-11 (with labeled wax paper? Overlays) > figs 1-84. > > > > Please tell me only the pages and figures you need. > > > > P 144 is Legion: Calopteryx and part of Legion Euphaea > > Taf. 11 figs 40-46 goes with Calopteryx. > > > > > > > > Bill Mauffray > > International Odonata Research Institute > > PO Box 147100 > > Gainesville FL 32614-7100 > > 352-219-3141 cell > > iodonata AT gmail.com > > http://www.iodonata.net > > > > From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu > [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Frederico A.A. > Lencioni > Sent: Monday, November 28, 2011 10:18 PM > To: Dirk Gassmann; odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > > > I also want a copy of this paper if possible. > > Thanks, > > > > Fred > > > > From: Dirk Gassmann > > Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2011 10:57 AM > > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > Subject: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > > > Dear Odonatologists, > > > > Does anyone have a pdf or scan of the following paper and would be so kind > to forward it to me by e-mail? > > > > Schmidt, E., 1934: > > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > > Zool. Jahrb. 39: 144, pi. 11 fig. 45. > > > > I had trouble to find it, also because there seems to be some confusion in > the literature > > about where and when the paper was published. So, the data given above are > rather approximative. > > > > Thank you in advance! > > > > Best wishes, > > Dirk Gassmann > > > > > > -- > Dirk Gassmann, PhD > Research Associate > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity > (NCB Naturalis) > P.O. Box 9517 > NL-2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl > dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com > > _____ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20111128/9871590c/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 11:55:04 +0000 > From: Dirk Gassmann > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > To: IORI , "'Frederico A.A. Lencioni'" > , "odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu" > > Message-ID: > <1322567704.22335.YahooMailNeo AT web29511.mail.ird.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Dear Bill, > ? > thanks again for looking up the reference! > It so happens that I finally found Schmidt's?paper in (another part) of our library. > Since I?intend to make a photocopy and a scan of?the whole?article anyway, > I offer to send the scan of the (large) paper to Fred and other interested odonatologists. > Will take some time though. > ? > Thanks again, > Dirk > > > ________________________________ > Von: IORI > An: 'Frederico A.A. Lencioni' ; 'Dirk Gassmann' ; odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Gesendet: 4:57 Dienstag, 29.November 2011 > Betreff: RE: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > > Fred, Dirk, et al: > ? > This is what I have: > ? > I have > ? > Schmidt, E., 1915: > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > Zool. Jahrb. 39: pp 87- 200, tafel 9-11 (with labeled wax paper? Overlays) ?figs 1-84.? > ? > Please tell me only the pages and figures you need. > ? > P 144 is Legion: Calopteryx and part of Legion Euphaea > Taf. 11 figs 40-46 goes with Calopteryx. > ? > ? > ? > Bill Mauffray > International Odonata Research Institute > PO Box 147100 > Gainesville FL 32614-7100 > 352-219-3141 cell > iodonata AT gmail.com > http://www.iodonata.net > ? > From:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Frederico A.A. Lencioni > Sent: Monday, November 28, 2011 10:18 PM > To: Dirk Gassmann; odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > ? > I also want a copy of this paper if possible. > Thanks, > ? > Fred > ? > From:Dirk Gassmann > Sent:Sunday, November 27, 2011 10:57 AM > To:odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject:[Odonata-l] Paper request > ? > Dear Odonatologists, > ? > Does anyone have a pdf or scan of the following paper and would be so kind to forward it to me by e-mail? > ? > Schmidt, E., 1934: > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > Zool. Jahrb. 39: 144, pi. 11 fig. 45.? > ? > I had trouble to find? it, also because there seems to be some confusion in the literature > about where and when the paper was published. So, the data given above are rather approximative. > ? > Thank you in advance! > ? > Best wishes, > Dirk Gassmann > ? > ? > -- > Dirk Gassmann, PhD > Research Associate > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity > (NCB Naturalis) > P.O. Box 9517 > NL-2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl > dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com > > ________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20111129/1d855c34/attachment.html > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > > End of Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 > ***************************************** -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 (APPinto) From: Ângelo P. Pinto <odonata_angelo AT hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2011 00:11:32 -0200 Dear colleagues, First all, I would like to thanks for all responses to my request concerning to Tombo paper. The paper asked by Dirk was published under a very confusing journal title. I do not know if you already have a copy... In anyway the title Zoologische jahrbucher has fused and/or was partitioned in some journals, one of them is now Zoologische Anzeiger and another one with the same title became Zoology. Based in the date and number of volume very likely is an older issue of Zoologische Anzeiger, obviously before have this name. I am in doubt but if it's the same paper cited by Bill it can be downloadable through this link: http://www.archive.org/download/zoologischejahrb1639jena/zoologischejahrb1639jena.pdf). If is not this one, and you still interested I can check in the library of Museum, but just in next week. Best wishes, Ângelo Pinto > From: odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 03:55:08 -0800 > > Send Odonata-l mailing list submissions to > odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu > > You can reach the person managing the list at > odonata-l-owner AT listhost.ups.edu > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Odonata-l digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Paper request (Frederico A.A. Lencioni) > 2. Re: Paper request (IORI) > 3. Re: Paper request (Dirk Gassmann) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 01:18:02 -0200 > From: "Frederico A.A. Lencioni" > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > To: Dirk Gassmann , > > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > I also want a copy of this paper if possible. > Thanks, > > Fred > > From: Dirk Gassmann > Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2011 10:57 AM > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > Dear Odonatologists, > > Does anyone have a pdf or scan of the following paper and would be so kind to forward it to me by e-mail? > > Schmidt, E., 1934: > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > Zool. Jahrb. 39: 144, pi. 11 fig. 45. > > I had trouble to find it, also because there seems to be some confusion in the literature > about where and when the paper was published. So, the data given above are rather approximative. > > Thank you in advance! > > Best wishes, > Dirk Gassmann > > > -- > Dirk Gassmann, PhD > Research Associate > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity > (NCB Naturalis) > P.O. Box 9517 > NL-2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl > dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20111129/da1aa91b/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2011 22:57:02 -0500 > From: IORI > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > To: "'Frederico A.A. Lencioni'" , "'Dirk > Gassmann'" , > Message-ID: <019e01ccae4a$f470fc40$dd52f4c0$ AT net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Fred, Dirk, et al: > > > > This is what I have: > > > > I have > > > > Schmidt, E., 1915: > > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > > Zool. Jahrb. 39: pp 87- 200, tafel 9-11 (with labeled wax paper? Overlays) > figs 1-84. > > > > Please tell me only the pages and figures you need. > > > > P 144 is Legion: Calopteryx and part of Legion Euphaea > > Taf. 11 figs 40-46 goes with Calopteryx. > > > > > > > > Bill Mauffray > > International Odonata Research Institute > > PO Box 147100 > > Gainesville FL 32614-7100 > > 352-219-3141 cell > > iodonata AT gmail.com > > http://www.iodonata.net > > > > From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu > [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Frederico A.A. > Lencioni > Sent: Monday, November 28, 2011 10:18 PM > To: Dirk Gassmann; odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > > > I also want a copy of this paper if possible. > > Thanks, > > > > Fred > > > > From: Dirk Gassmann > > Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2011 10:57 AM > > To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > > Subject: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > > > Dear Odonatologists, > > > > Does anyone have a pdf or scan of the following paper and would be so kind > to forward it to me by e-mail? > > > > Schmidt, E., 1934: > > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > > Zool. Jahrb. 39: 144, pi. 11 fig. 45. > > > > I had trouble to find it, also because there seems to be some confusion in > the literature > > about where and when the paper was published. So, the data given above are > rather approximative. > > > > Thank you in advance! > > > > Best wishes, > > Dirk Gassmann > > > > > > -- > Dirk Gassmann, PhD > Research Associate > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity > (NCB Naturalis) > P.O. Box 9517 > NL-2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl > dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com > > _____ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20111128/9871590c/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 11:55:04 +0000 > From: Dirk Gassmann > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > To: IORI , "'Frederico A.A. Lencioni'" > , "odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu" > > Message-ID: > <1322567704.22335.YahooMailNeo AT web29511.mail.ird.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Dear Bill, > ? > thanks again for looking up the reference! > It so happens that I finally found Schmidt's?paper in (another part) of our library. > Since I?intend to make a photocopy and a scan of?the whole?article anyway, > I offer to send the scan of the (large) paper to Fred and other interested odonatologists. > Will take some time though. > ? > Thanks again, > Dirk > > > ________________________________ > Von: IORI > An: 'Frederico A.A. Lencioni' ; 'Dirk Gassmann' ; odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Gesendet: 4:57 Dienstag, 29.November 2011 > Betreff: RE: [Odonata-l] Paper request > > > Fred, Dirk, et al: > ? > This is what I have: > ? > I have > ? > Schmidt, E., 1915: > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > Zool. Jahrb. 39: pp 87- 200, tafel 9-11 (with labeled wax paper? Overlays) ?figs 1-84.? > ? > Please tell me only the pages and figures you need. > ? > P 144 is Legion: Calopteryx and part of Legion Euphaea > Taf. 11 figs 40-46 goes with Calopteryx. > ? > ? > ? > Bill Mauffray > International Odonata Research Institute > PO Box 147100 > Gainesville FL 32614-7100 > 352-219-3141 cell > iodonata AT gmail.com > http://www.iodonata.net > ? > From:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Frederico A.A. Lencioni > Sent: Monday, November 28, 2011 10:18 PM > To: Dirk Gassmann; odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Paper request > ? > I also want a copy of this paper if possible. > Thanks, > ? > Fred > ? > From:Dirk Gassmann > Sent:Sunday, November 27, 2011 10:57 AM > To:odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > Subject:[Odonata-l] Paper request > ? > Dear Odonatologists, > ? > Does anyone have a pdf or scan of the following paper and would be so kind to forward it to me by e-mail? > ? > Schmidt, E., 1934: > Morphologie des 2. und 3. Abdominalsegments bei maennlichen Libellen. > Zool. Jahrb. 39: 144, pi. 11 fig. 45.? > ? > I had trouble to find? it, also because there seems to be some confusion in the literature > about where and when the paper was published. So, the data given above are rather approximative. > ? > Thank you in advance! > ? > Best wishes, > Dirk Gassmann > ? > ? > -- > Dirk Gassmann, PhD > Research Associate > Netherlands Centre for Biodiversity > (NCB Naturalis) > P.O. Box 9517 > NL-2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > e-mail: Dirk.Gassmann AT ncbnaturalis.nl > dirk_gassmann AT yahoo.com > > ________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20111129/1d855c34/attachment.html > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > > End of Odonata-l Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13 > ***************************************** _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.pugetsound.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l